"The subjects of every state ought to contribute toward the support of the government, as nearly as possible, in proportion to their respective abilities; that is, in proportion to the revenue which they respectively enjoy under the protection of the state ....[As Henry Home (Lord Kames) has written, a goal of taxation should be to] 'remedy inequality of riches as much as possible, by relieving the poor and burdening the rich.'" -Adam Smith
George Ryan's Cellmate
· 2 years ago
Rich,
Good reminder for posts about these subjects, i.e. GRT and HB 750, and all subjects. These are complicated proposals and a big benefit of this and other blogs is the ability for experts to explain, analyze and offer opinions about these big ideas. However, sometimes folks let their passions for the players overwhelm the discussion.
One more thing: care to ask the Governor if he has a Question of the Day he'd like to ask ?
Solidarity?
· 2 years ago
Ouch. Well 750 seems like a none starter, both Jones and Blago have said they will not pass it and I love that Speaker Madigan moved it out of committee the day after Jones comes out against it. Brilliant.
Why has there not been much talk about amending the constitution to make the income tax progressive? Also, there hasn't been much talk about Quinn’s initiative which could possibly bring in $2 billion a year. Maybe it’s goofy I don’t know, but can we modify it to make it work? I’m adamantly for closing corporate loops holes on truly big businesses but it’s important to remember that a small business can still bring in gross revenue of $15 - $20 million a year; it just depends on the industry.
Also, here is a thought about increasing revenue for the state; create a jobs program. Lets get people good paying jobs with benefits. It’s obviously hard to do, but if the governor would sit down with business and labor groups and work something out together it might happen. Here’s a first step, a transportation bill and $250 million isn’t enough.
Louis G. Atsaves
· 2 years ago
It's not the Kool-Aid on the bus you should be worried about. You should be worried about the brownies! : -)
The basic outrage is Governor I'm Anti-Tax and Governor I'm Going to Protect You Poor Taxpayers At All Costs just elect me over that Tax Happy Topinka and everything will be fine and dandy Blagojevich immediately after the election proposes and campaigns for the largest tax increase in Illinois history? Quibble away over who pays and who doesn't and what the hidden cost to everyone is and simply ask: WHAT WAS HE THINKING?
All those Democrats in my Lake County who were elected to go to Springfield on a platform of fiscal conservatism and anti-taxation. Not a peep from a single one of them since the Governor made his proposal! And with the Wisconsin border just a few minutes away . . . . . . . . . . . . . .
Cap'n Crud
· 2 years ago
Rich: I agree that the vehemence of the anti-guv postings is often over the top, and could use a bit more gentility. But I do have to say that I generally see HB750 getting beaten-up pretty badly here, too. There are a lot of bloody noses in this bloggy neighborhood, for good or bad. Enjoy the rest of the bus tour --
DOWNSTATE
· 2 years ago
And as usual you are probably right.The main problem is no on wants to set down in a room and work out a Governor-Democrat-Republican-what is in the best interest of the people deal.Everyone is screaming my way or the hiway and that is fiscal irresponsibility plus you have him with new give aways instead of paying old bills.Oh first was the letter to us business people and now we get a post card.I got mine today.
The Goat
· 2 years ago
Mr. Miller,
Bravo on a heartfelt blog. However, it undermines your credibility when you say you've been tougher on the governor than anybody else. You'd do well to follow your own advice here and not get overly emotional about your subject matter.
Anonymous
· 2 years ago
A tax is a tax, just say no!
VanillaMan
· 2 years ago
Way back around the turn of this century, about 2002, many of us realized that Illinois was not doing well financially. Taxes were in our future, as well as budget balancing and more cost cutting. We needed a governor who would use creative means to get our state in order and then see what taxes would be needed, (if any), to help us invest in our future. (I realize how general this overview is.)
Rod took over and indeed tried creative things to make ends meet. He froze hiring and he looked like he would make tough decisions. But he didn't stick with it. He started going shopping. He increased our budget by a billion a year, instead of trying to keep spending down. He paid for his shopping trips with creative accounting and deficit spending. We all recognized the Christmas shopping and overspending he was doing. We knew he was cooking the books and waiting for our economy to pay off his bills. As he was doing all of this, he was losing support from fiscal conservatives and independants who were willing to let his shop and spend, but not very please with what they were also seeing - important medical bills going unpaid, pension payments going unpaid, and a stagnant job market while neighboring states grew at our expense. Blagojevich looked like he was too busy fiddling around and no longer looked serious.
Now this! It is like a mask fell from his face, and with his reelection, we are seeing just another 'tax and spender'. He knows he wasn't elected to play this game. He was elected to reform government, not expand it by 30%.
We haven't forgotten what we wanted to see five years ago. We wanted a reformed, efficient state government. We wanted a governor who counted every penny and spent wisely. Rod Blagojevich didn't deliver what he promised us.
He is on a bus, selling us a self-promoted legacy. It has no support from his running mate, his comptroller, his treasurer, the majority of Illinois businesses, or the majority of Illinois voters. He wants 7-8+ BILLION tax dollars. Yet he hasn't shown that he has balanced our budget, made our government more efficient, reformed our government, changed the way we do business, or anything he promised when he was first elected.
He had respect. He lost it. This bus trip didn't help him regain it. My advice is for him to sit down with the other adults in charge of our state and do another tour where he shows what he has accomplished with the money he gets annually. Then ask for more. His lack of humility behind pulpits and his 'god-talk' needs to be forgotten before he can expect anything more from us.
grand old partisan
· 2 years ago
Rich,
I was doing gov’t affairs for one of the larger local chambers of commerce here in IL a few years ago when 750 first became an issue (I have since moved on to other work). We did a few calls-to-action and wrote some letters, but not much more because (1) it never really made it onto the front burner and (2) the governor promised to veto it anyway - as he had promised he would do to any increases in his 2002 campaign.
Why is the rhetoric more heated and urgent in opposition to the GRT? Well, for starters, it’s because this is THE front burner issue, because the Governor (who is breaking both his 2002 & 2006 campaign pledges to not raise taxes) is essentially holding everyone else’s issues and agenda hostage until he gets this passed….a tactic never employed by the backers of 750.
Obviously, the hair-brained comments about you “drinking the kool-aide†are ridiculous and out of line. But I think the Governor deserves every bit of vitriol that comes his way on this bus tour.
Bill Baar
· 2 years ago
In case you forgot, he won the election last year...
Would he have won if he had let voters know this was on his mind?
Topinka suggested some alternatives and went agains much of her party over gambling. You wrote favorably of her for it Rich.
The Gov had to have been hiding this behemoth and I think Illinoisians right to resent him springing it on us.
nomoretax
· 2 years ago
Good post capn'crud,I suggest Mr. Miller take your criticism to heart.
Doodles
· 2 years ago
Alright, here's some perspectives on 750. Swapping higher income taxes for property tax reduction benefits who? Does it benefit those that choose to live in higher property tax places, supposedly where schools are better? Does it benefit those that choose to spend more of their income on property (their house) and thus have high property taxes? For those that don't make such choices, does it just mean higher income taxes? Does it mean they end up subsidizing the first group? Is that more fair than the current system?
Does more funding for education equate to better education? From the strong support of teacher organizations for either 750 or the GRT, I suspect it at least means higher teacher salaries. Do higher teacher salaries mean better education?
So-Called "Austin Mayor"
· 2 years ago
"barring a conviction *** we’re all stuck with this guy for another term, for better or for worse"
Rich,
I'm not sure how anyone could honestly think you'd drank the Blago-Aid.
And stop smashing my dreams of a conviction.
-- SCAM
Cap'n Crud
· 2 years ago
nomoretax: Thanks, but - to be clearer - I didn't intend to criticize our host as much as emphasize that blog-posters seem to hammer 750 as well as hammering the guv. There's fairly equal-opportunity hammering going on already.
leigh
· 2 years ago
Help me out here. Why is Quinn the only one I have heard who wants to address the corporate loopholes that are allowing some of the huge corporations to skip out on taxes? Why isn't anyone talking about cutting spending? Forget HB750 and the GRT. Time to come up with a real and workable plan for the people of Illinois. I am tired of the name calling and posturing. Is there any chance Madigan might be working on something? Jones and Blago seem unwilling to listen
Little Egypt
· 2 years ago
I know that some press will often, if not always, accompany some politicians when they go on tours (White House press corps coming immediately to mind). I think you are taking a lot of hits here for being on the bus because some are afraid you are going to lose your perspective of what is really behind Blago's proposals. Yes, you are a professional and have been doing this for a long time. But a lot of us see how convincing and conniving Blago can be. Right now, for me, it's a matter of keeping my faith in you that you will be able to sort through all of this hype and report the situation in a fair and balanced manner like you have become known for doing. References to "don't drink the Kool-aid", in my opinion, are just a reminder from us to you to keep your perspective. Perhaps we should trust you more to be able to do that. However, the "high" of being a part of a captive audience and hearing Blago's war chant on a 24/7 basis for 4 days is hopefully something you can shake very quickly. I know you are either dog tired or having a blast (probably both at the same time). But please give us the side of the picture that Blago does not want us to see. Perhaps there are good things going on that Blago does not want to brag about because he knows it won't be received well anyway. I'm hoping that you can break away occasionally and talk with some local business people and report their views, pro and/or con.
We're not against you Rich. We are definitely for you. My problem with this whole GRT thing is why can't this governor, past governors and future governors forget their own agenda for their first 4 years and simply pay the State's past due bills? Is that really asking too much? Why can't they put this State on a solid financial footing before proposing more programs and then floating a tax to pay for them? I'm not against more funding for schools. I'm not against health insurance for the uninsured. In a perfect world, we would fund education fairly in all school districts and everyone would have the health insurance coverage they need and should have. But this is not a perfect world and this state is in hock up to its eyebrows. I know Blago would like to have a legacy of taking care of children - from their educational needs to their healthcare needs. I know he wants to be known as the governor who has helped families the most. What he's going to be known for is the same ol' same ol' - a governor who doesn't address the debt of this state and puts forth his own agenda, placing further debt upon all of us.
Bill Baar
· 2 years ago
Why tax corporations at all? That's money directed at investment that hopefully creates jobs and wealth for people...
...'cause it's people who pay taxes and they can't pay if they're broke without jobs.
This will happen with any issue. Lines are being drawn in the sand everywhere and it seems as though politicians are refusing to negotiate or at least talk civilly. Either you're for the war or against it. Either you're for univeral health care or against it. Either you're for the GRT or against it. Here's an idea: compromise! Find a way to buckle down and still help those most in need. Find a way to make businesses meet their obligations while allowing a business' leaders the freedom to run their own company without fear of having to move across state lines.
Elected officials are paid and paid well to deal with every day issues. They hold high positions and get to tell the rest of us what to do. Let's see a little bit of accountability and dialogue without all the partisanship. Is that really too much to ask?!
prairiestatedem
· 2 years ago
Since you are on Hair Force One with Blago you may not have seen Molly's story in the PJ Star. She had an intresting quote from Blago which im sure he wouldnt have done in your earshot
"I was meant to be raised on a farm. Isn't this nice?"
While I agree that lots of our fellow Bloggers are sometimes overzealous in thier hatred the above quote is one of the all too typical incredebly over the top fake and meaningless instances which have come to personify this administration.
Will
· 2 years ago
I don't see how anyone could disagree with your post. I'm glad you're trying to raise the level of discourse a little bit, but I don't believe that's possible as long as the political debate is dominated by conservative talk radio hosts and columnists who dish out daily doses of anger and childish ridicule. Its an infectious attitude and the fact that people like Ann Coulter and Rush Limbaugh are given a national platform is bound to trickle down to hateful and petty comments on your blog and every other political discussion in the country. So, I'm not sure what good your post is going to do, but I hope people listen.
Commonsense in Illinois
· 2 years ago
As with any proposal for increasing any tax, the real question is what will the additional revenue give us? So far, the proponents for both SB 1 and HB 750 point to more money for education, funding health care and other "worthy" agenda items. But usually that's about a far as it goes. If we send another billion (or $10 billion for that matter) for education funding, what should we expect? I for one would like to see higher graduation rates, higher college entrances, higher achievment scores, the ability to fire under-performing teachers, and a host of other measurable outcomes. On healthcare, I think there is a legitimate policy discussion that says perhaps we should make a concerted effort to develop new jobs in those sectors where nearly 98 percent of those employers provide health care coverage for their workers (Information Technology and Manufacturing). I don't fault the governor for having passion for his initiatives, but the real question for me comes down to this...After raising spending on average by $1 billion over the last four years, what outcomes can we expect (or should you demand as governor) if taxes are raised on one sector or our overall economy by more than $8 billion? And that's a question that proponents for neither bill have been willing to answer.
S. Illinois
· 2 years ago
Rich - yes, the rhetoric here is often over the top. But I hope you share this message with your bus-mate as well. He originated much of this message of hate and should expect some sharp elbows in return. Don't demonize people and expect them to just roll over and accept it. (Board of Education, Business Comuunity, State Workers, etc.) Blagojevich has carefully cultivated the hate that is currently directed at him. He shouldn't seem so surprised by it. We do want intelligent debate over the dire issues facing the fiscal future of this state. Sadly, our chief executive seems incapable of it.
The Horse
· 2 years ago
Keep up the fight rich.
now, the real problem is the spinless politicos of all stripes who refuse to acknolwedge that the state has not had a balanced budget for years, and their steadfast unwillingness to raise the $ to pay the bills.
Is this the best way? IMHO, probably not, but it is a recognition of the need to RAISE $
keep on keeping on bro
Just a Citizen
· 2 years ago
Rich, Your words were right on the mark. Taxes are always a hot button item and no matter how you slice it, folks get emotional about the potential of even more money coming out of their pockets when that money is rarely used in a reasonable and prudent manner.
But you have always taken a fair and unbiased point of view towards all issues and I know you will continue to do so. Thanks for giving us the insight to help make up our minds on the many issues that plague our state.
Reformed
· 2 years ago
Why does it have to be GRT or HB750? Why not none of the above? This state would not have a shortage of cash and would have more money to fund schools if new social programs were not created. Why won't anyone in the media ask if such a program is really necessary?
RMW Stanford
· 2 years ago
I am one of the one that does not want an expansion of the State's tax or think it is in the best long run interest of the state, the tax burden per capita in Illinois is already in the upper half of that for the states. I prefer to see spending cut for unneeded programs and no unneeded ones added and then more funding added to education. Quite frankly just because a social program sound nice and might help some parts of society does not mean that the State should enact it or that it benefits out weight cost. You can not keep raising taxes in order to pay for expanded government programs or you will keep driving out business and discourage new ones from setting up shop here, and business, not government programs, is what grows the economy. I think that the GRT is just plan bad for state, I dont think it will be applied to out of state companies in the same way as it will be to in-state companies and even it is the compounding effect will still leave in state companies at disadvantage compared to ones based out of state, it will hurt economic and employment growth and catch a lot of companies that are not "big business". Even if it only affects 15 percent of the businesses in the State, what percentage of the state employment and economy do you think those 15 percentage of business make up? I am going to bet its a pretty big percentage and included most of the companies that consumers deal with on day to day bases. All this being said, I agree that the state needs to close up the tax loop holes so that larger companies do pay their share of the corporate income tax.
vole
· 2 years ago
People are tired of the endless campaign style of governing we see represented with this bus tour. We were unhappy with the choice presented to us in the last election. This was made particularly unpalatable by the blatantly misleading, negative ads run by the Blagojevich camp against Topinka.
Putting this aside, most criticisms of the GRT I have read in my infrequent musings of posts here have dwelled mostly on the pros or cons of the GRT itself. I do not think that bias against Blagojevich played a significant role in the evaluations of the proposal itself. The manner in which it was presented by villifying targets of the GRT tax certainly did not help with moving the proposal through a reasoned process of deliberation and debate. No matter what the intentions, some wounds are self inflicted.
RMW Stanford
· 2 years ago
Yes the Governor did get re-elected but one of the major things he ran on was not raising taxes, while he may have been referring to the income and sales tax. I dont think that many of the people that voted for him expected a multi-billion dollar new tax on businesses.
Ali Bin Haddin
· 2 years ago
I do not know about that Kool-Aid stuff but I do have access to some voodoo dolls. Bids are open.
Question for the Gov
· 2 years ago
Rich,
Since you have the Governor’s ear, why don't ask the governor how he saved The State of Illinois money by eliminating my single position and replaced me with 5 people who weren't even qualified? Let's do the math, round numbers to keep it simple, let's say I was making $50k +benefits, then governor and/or his administration hires 5 people to replace me at $35K +benefits. That's $175K per year +benefits. That's $125K he's spending beyond what my salary was. How does that SAVE the state money? I was exemplary state employee with an excellent work record. But this is how our Governor rewards hardworking state employees. Oh, by the way, my family and I haven't had health insurance for 4 years.
Frustrated GOP
· 2 years ago
Rich, Sorry for the Kool-aid comment, was meant in jest. My problem with this whole format is the one party system and the fact that there isn't a lot of discussion about more options. The winning combination to our problems is going to be a mix of revenue enhancements. We continue to hit too small of the population on taxes, both corporate and otherwise. What's more, too often the solution is hitting fringe items that impact some of those really needing the money. Has anyone really asked how someone gets a profit from running the lottery? What areas buy the most tickets? So if a private company takes the lottery and really goes after their main customers who is impacted? I bet they don't sell a lot of Lottery tickets in Oakbrook or Hinsdale, not per person. I might agree we need adjsutment to corporate income taxation. This is what this adminstration is supporting.
OneManBlog
· 2 years ago
As for 750 vs. GRT, to be blunt, any tax increase this size. Even if it is only money from other people (my favorite kind of tax) makes me a bit nervous. Looking at pensions, schools and the like I question if the state is a good steward of money.
Also the us vs. them thing on the GRT kinds of gets under my skin. It is too easy to make business a hobgoblin.
Heck the health care thing is a noble cause, part of me thinks if it is that important then everyone should help pay for it.
OneMan
N20 Express
· 2 years ago
yuk,yuk,yuk,yuk,yuk,yuk,yuk,yuk,yuk,yuk,yuk,yuk, yuk,yuk,yuk,yuk,yuk,yuk,yuk,yuk,yuk,yuk,yuk,yuk, yuk,yuk,yuk,yuk. The Gov must be a hoot!
steven
· 2 years ago
I think when you look at how lotteries in other states have successfully expanded, it is in expanding to areas outside of the typical poorer communities.
From a marketer's perspective, those areas are tapped. Expanding multi-state options (like PowerBall and MegaMillions) has actually shown to attract more lottery buyers from middle and working class folk. More excitement and higher dollar amounts lead to a broader base of customers.
This would most likely be the same thing that would happen here in Illinois.
Think about it - If Powerball and MegaMillions merge (and reduce the odds), there could possibly be a $1 billion lottery jackpot in our lifetimes.
Millionaires would be playing that game...
Just a thought.
steven
· 2 years ago
I meant to say "more lottery buyers from middle class than working class folk"
Chris McNeil
· 2 years ago
Rich, Catch your breath. The Governor has solidly been against HB750, as have many in the GA. Most seem to think HB750 is a non-issue. If the liklihood of 750 getting passed increases, you will no doubt see a bunch of postings on it.
Cap Fx Addict
· 2 years ago
Rich:
Since you are on the bus with him, can you ask the governor if he can write a special exemption in the GRT for capitol fax? :-)
Frustrated GOP
· 2 years ago
steven - You are probably right on the market expansion. Yes, when the pot goes up everyone gets in, but what I spend in a month on such things is less then what I spend on fancy coffee drinks in a week, I can afford to do that, it doesn't significantly impact my kid's college fund. What I see in places that need that money is the opposite. It sells false hope. What's worse is this admin wants to sell it off to privitize to increase the market of selling false hope. Hard to connect that with wanting to serve all the children and give everyone universal health care. But then again they haven't exactly been out infront of trying to bring costs down by mal-practice reform. They pick and choose. Sure most do, but don't attempt to stake the moral high ground when you aren't leading the charge in places that really have impact to the State.
Drew
· 2 years ago
Fair enough...Here are a few gripes about 750.
1. The state's individual income tax is already regressive in that low income folks feel its effects more than people on the higher end of the socio-economic ladder. Hiking the rates from 3 percent to 5 percent would only make things worse.
2. One of the "perks" for tax payers is supposedly that property owners would get some cut in their income taxes. That's a nice concept, but this plan is again regressive in that low-income and young people seldom own homes.
3. Does anybody honestly think that local governments won't jack property taxes back up again after HB 750 reduces them?
Many states have actually cut taxes over the past few years in part to attract businesses, new jobs, and new sources of tax revenue. We, on the other hand, are running in the opposite direction. Sadly, the folks in the state capital seem to never find a spending proposal they don't like. If this weren't the case, we could perhaps be like other states and be talking about whether and to what extent we should cut taxes.
750 may look attractive when compared to the GRT, but it's still like jumping off the top of a twenty story building as opposed to a forty.
steve schnorf
· 2 years ago
Rich, personally, I think you allow too much (anonymous) ranting on most topics on the site, but it's your site.
i d
· 2 years ago
I haven't been here for a few day but after reading some of the back comments I think that Rich is attempting to be a reporter both on and off the record and is finding it impossible to be effective on either stance. Rich, it is you and not "us".
Bill
· 2 years ago
For the first time in three decades, almost all, except the most reactionary, are finally admitting that the state has a structural deficit and that in order to continue to provide and enhance services to the citizens, our state needs to enhance revenue. There is now debate about how to raise revenue instead of whether to raise it. We have Gov. Blagojevich to thank for shaping the nature of this debate. The Gov has proposed many ways over the past five years to change the way Illinois conducts itself. Each time, he has endured personal criticism and his proposals have been met with derision. Pre-school,Allkids, cutting the bloated state workforce,Keno, leasing the tollway, selling the lotttery, pension reform, capital bonds, pension bonds,universal health insurance, etc..These were new and innovative ideas that prompted intense criticism. However, throughout all of the criticism, no alternative plans to solve the problems were suggested by his critics. It is easy to criticize, slander, and make fun. It is not so easy to suggest viable alternatives. ( I don't consider closing the public schools, abolishing the property tax, reneging on pensions, etc. viable), Throughout his tenure, the Gov. has courageously stuck to his pledge to change business as usual in Illinois. He keeps trying to come up with policies and programs that he feels will improve people's quality of life. Things will be a lot different after this session then they were previously. We will have the Governor to thank (or blame). I always felt that during the camapign, Rich went out of his way to blast Rod. Remember OY! and reform and renewal #1,987,654? It was obvious to me that he wanted his good friend Judy to win. Now, after the election, he is showing his maturity and professionalism as a journalist by avioding the "I hate Rod" trap and reporting fairly and accurately on the issues. In reality, the Governor is a good guy trying to do the right thing. You may not agree with his methods or his policies. If you don't, come up with some constructive viuable, alternatives instead of the barrage of juvenile taunts and insults. Blagojevich pictures himself as the little guy's champion. So do I. Pass the Kool Aid. It tastes great to me.
Yellow Dog Democrat
· 2 years ago
Rich -
I think the raucous opposition from the governor is driven by two factors.
First, policy:
The Civic Committee, representing the largest business interests in Illinois, endorsed the very same income tax increases outlined in HB 750, so you can hardly portray that portion of HB 750 as being anti-business. And the Taxpayers Federation, in committee testimony, acknowledged the need to establish a service tax in Illinois, as well as the fact that surrounding states also tax these same services. So there is no business argument that folks are suddenly going going to be driving to Missouri to get their hair cut, because Missouri and all neighboring states tax hair cuts.
Secondly, we can't ignore the fact that the GRT is a much bigger net tax increase than HB 750. Nor that most of the spending in the Governor's plan will be diverted to other things besides education -- which poll after poll has solidly identified as the top priority of voters. So, whether you call the Gov's spending proposal "pork", or some other name, its in there.
Secondly, process:
Whether the Governor hastily through together his plan after the election, or has always been planning on a GRT and just hid that fact from voters, the way he's advanced his plan is screwy. Call him confrontational, adversarial, manipulative, deceptive, all of the adjectives fit.
In addition, his rhetoric doesn't match the reality of his proposal. The Governor's attack on HB 750 is that he won't raise taxes on working people. Bu even his budget director admits that it's atleast possible that the GRT will be passed on to consumers. Economic experts are saying its a given, backed up by projections from the Illinois Petroleum Marketers Association that the price of gasoline will rise 4 to 10 cents, reports that groceries and prescription drugs will see an increase in prices due to the GRT, and numerous other sources. You see that reflected in the poll results you've reported here, that the majority of voters believe the Governor has broken his promise not to raise income or sales taxes. Granted, he's found a sly way of doing it, but voters resent being played for a fool even more than they resent taxes.
I predicted a long time ago that the Governor would break all of his campaign promises, except his promise not to raise taxes, and that one day he would do that. That day is here, and now the choice for the Governor is simple: do I continue to fight against leaders from my own party and push my tax increase plan, which only one-third of Illinoisans support? Or do I work with all of the leaders from my own party to fine tune a plan that has been around for 20+ years and which the majority of Illinois supports?
The old saying goes "There's no limit to what you can accomplish if you don't care who gets the credit."
The Blagojevich Corollary is "You can't expect to accomplish much if you adopt a 'My way or the highway' attitude and insist on getting all the credit."
Then again, maybe accomplishing very little while making a lot of noise (we used to call it 'imitating work') is what the Governor had in mind all along.
Entitled To My Opinion
· 2 years ago
I don't hate Rod. It's very simple, I just think Governor Blagojevich is corrupt and he lied about ending business as usual. End of story, Bill.
6'2" Yeti
· 2 years ago
A agree with Drew, why can't we ever see a budget that cuts back on spending. Of course that may be like jumping off a 60 story building.
Bill
· 2 years ago
All of a sudden, HB 750 has a champion in yellow lapdog democrat. When he talks about "leaders of his own party" does he mean just one, recalcitrant, hard to work with, leader. The Governor has worked with Senate President Emil Jones, truly a leader of his party, to formulate what they feel is a more progressive plan which yields more revenue and which is inherently more equitable than the income tax increase/property tax swap. He has consulted with his allies in the House and Senate who are elected leaders of his party. He has worked with Mayor Daley, truly a leader of his party. Let's see, who does that leave? Could it be that the other leader won't work with Rod? Why? Personal reasons,maybe?
Can of Whoopass
· 2 years ago
To: Entitled To My Opinion
Governor Blaogjevich ESCALATED "Business as Usual". Rod needs to resign before he causes Illinois anymore embarassment.
nomoretax
· 2 years ago
Bill, I thought you were giving a speech in Alton ?
steven
· 2 years ago
I think this sums up Rich's argument about the Trib pretty clearly:
"Tribune bosses' big paydays: Executives will rake in cash while workers take risk, company goes further into debt"
I wish I didn't have to pay taxes, I could be just like the Tribune, too!
A Citizen
· 2 years ago
Bill, I have read and heard much discussion on the GRT and 750. I still suggest that the appropriate action is neither of them but rather a complete review and restructuring of the state's taxing system coupled with the elimination of the property tax. The current "system" is based on a non service economy of several decades ago. In the time since the economic evolution has been to a dominant service based one. Thus any GRT or 750 that fails to totally recast the taxing system reflecting the current economic model fails to really modernize our system and assure fairness in the process.
RMW Stanford
· 2 years ago
How exactly is the GRT more progressive than the income tax, with the income tax even with a flat rate people that have income pay more in raw terms, but with the GRT that not the case since it based on revenue, which is not the same as income for business. Under the GRT you could have two companies that because they are in different industries earn the same revenue but have different profit margins and hence different incomes. The companies with lower profit margins would end up seeing a higher percentage of those profits going to the State to pay taxes. How is that progressive? Large percentage of the tax will be passe don to consumer via higher prices, price could easily rise by more than the tax rate because of the compounding effect of a good being taxed during each stage of production, higher prices will have a disproportionate effect on lower income groups that spend most or all of their income on goods and services. How is that effect less regressive than the sales tax or more progressive than the income tax?
It's 5 O'clock somewhere
· 2 years ago
Rich, Ask the Gov what is "Fair Share"
Some Guy
· 2 years ago
Bill Baar: Would he have won if he had let voters know this was on his mind?
Sure. In a normal election year maybe not. Against a functioning state Republican party, it would've been dicier. But as a Dem running in 2006 in this state he was in as good a shape as a politician can possibly be.
Yellow Dog Democrat
· 2 years ago
Bill -
I've always been a supporter of HB 750, so please stop your ignorant personal attacks.
When I say that the Governor isn't working with leaders of his own party, I'm referring to the Chairman of the Democratic Party/Speaker of the Illinois House, State Treasurer, State Comptroller, Lt. Governor, and Mayor of Chicago, all of whom have expressed grave concerns regarding or direct opposition to the Governor's plan. Other than the Senate President, who has relegated himself to the position of the Governor's Yes Man, I'm unaware of any elected leader in Illinois except State Rep. Mike Boland that has publicly supported the Governor's Gross Receipts Tax. Not even the Democratic County Chairmen with family members on the Governor's payroll are publicly backing his plan as written. If I'm wrong, please tell me.
Team Sleep
· 2 years ago
It's tough to support a plan that was probably hashed together on a napkin at the local greasy spoon and then presented in front of the state. Magically, two or more weeks later, we have the details. Then, a week or so after that, we have a changed plan structure. Huh? What is that? Does Blago just come up with an "idea" and then task his staff to do all the work? Why can't they get something done BEFORE the plan comes out? At least HB750 was constructed before it was released to the press.
And Bill, Emil does not have a vision and does not really care about "the little people". Look at his D-2s and tell me otherwise. He wants money for schools so that the IFT and IEA can keep pumping his slush funds full of cash, and he won't touch the electric rate issue. That is not leadership; that is greed. MJM, for all of his faults, seems more concerned about balancing the budget and restoring normalcy to the governing process.
I think tangent rants are great for this website. It keeps everyone interested and makes for some great conversation.
Old Elephant
· 2 years ago
I feel kinda special, since I am now among "the most reactionary" who have yet to be convinced that "in order to continue to provide and enhance services to the citizens, our state needs to enhance revenue."
But, let's be honest here. If the Governor had said BEFORE the election that he believes Illinois needs to increase taxes by $8-9 billion to expand services, then we would have had a referendum on that question. But, he campaigned on the lie that he was opposed to higher taxes and did not deal with the issue honestly.
Even now, the Governor doesn't really want to put the question to the public. A Gross Receipts Tax is bad public policy in part because it hides the true cost of government from the taxpayers. Despite the Governor's childish, over-the-top class warfare language, not one "evil corporation" will pay the tax, they'll just collect them.
I don't support HB 750, but at least it is fairly straightforward.
If we really need to expand services, provide universal healthcare and substantially increase education spending, why not tell the public honestly and truthfully what the cost of those service expansions will be?
Is it that we are afraid that once they know how much it will cost them, they'll decide it's not worth the money?
Everyday, consumers make decisons about the value and cost of goods on both small and large items: Is it worth an extra 50 cents to buy Cheerios instead of "Oaty Oats?" Is it worth it to buy the 2007 model or can I keep the old car going for awhile longer?
Why is it that liberals -- and a fair number of conservatives -- refuse to trust these same people to be responsible consumers of government.
In one way, both George Bush and Rod Blagojevich are exactly the same -- they have tried to hide the true cost of government from the people by spending more than we take in and passing the cost onto future generations. (And, now, Blagojevich wants to hide billions in taxes from the public by pretending it's a tax on "business."
If it is "reactionary" to let the taxpayers decide how they want their tax dollars spent, then I'm proud to be called a reactionary.
puzzler
· 2 years ago
A few corrections: few if any low-income folks pay income tax and in fact get back more than they pay in courtesy of the Earned Income Credit as long as they're working some type of job. Has anyone asked why so many corporations don't pay state income tax? Are they choosing to invest in depreciable assets versus paying tax? I can live with that if the investments are in Illinois. We also need to remember that the employees of these corporations pay millions in state income tax from salaries and wages paid to them by the corporation. Industry pays a disproportionate share of property tax, especially considering they don't send kids to school. I think what bothers most people who have contact with this Governor is that his administration has elevated "pay to play" to an artform. Special interests are getting increased pensions at the expense of a lot of "working men and women". The big voting block of over 65ers has gotten unprecedented property tax breaks at the expense of young familes who must make up the difference. And don't even get me started on the influence of Organized Labor on this administration...
Mr. Wizard
· 2 years ago
Leigh, 6' 2" & others -
Here's a simple reason nobody talks about spending cuts, efficiency, etc. First, think about the cumulative lobbying power of those who support education, health care, and human services. Now, look at the budget request for '08:
Total GF budget: $28.86 Billion Educ. - 39.4% Healthcare and families - 29.7% Human Svcs. - 20.4% All 3 - 89.5% or $25.8 Billion
Simple calculation shows just over $3 Billion is left for EVERYTHING else. Wipe out all other state GF spending (including the elected officials) and there's barely enough to pay the pension debt.
Wanna cut spending? You must cut education, health care and human services......
Team Sleep
· 2 years ago
YDD brings up a great point. When very few members of your own party support a major plan like the GRT, you are in trouble. And Mike Boland is irrelevant. If MJM hadn't stepped in and helped out, Steve Haring would be the state rep for the 71st District. Boland had better watch it, because his shenanigans are not smart.
Papa Legba
· 2 years ago
Bill,
You bring up these topics and say we just rip on Blago for any idea he comes up with. Here are some short answers for you.
Pre-school – No funding mechanism, reduces existing state revenues. A feel good Sunday press release.
Allkids – Can’t pay our outstanding medical bills now, no funding mechanism, reduces existing state revenues, no doctors want any part or it. A feel good Sunday press release.
Cutting the bloated state workforce – Shove old time, front line workers out the door and replace them with inexperienced, massively over-paid political hacks. Hide “employees†by using contracts.
Keno – DOA and pie-in-the-sky fantasy.
Leasing the tollway – Can we lease what we don’t own? The original bonds still haven’t been paid off.
Selling the lottery – Short-term cash infusion with nothing to replace revenue currently generated by the Lotto.
Pension reform – Nothing yet. Just a sound good, sound bite.
Capital bonds – Like Illinois needs more debt. Try reducing spending instead.
Pension bonds – Did that once. Where did the money go? Why is the pension still hugely under funded?
Universal health insurance – Feel good Sunday press release. No funding mechanism, reduces existing state revenues.
Why should we back these ideas when the are not sound plans and have no details?
VanillaMan
· 2 years ago
When Blagojevich can tell us that Pat Quinn, Dan Hynes, Mike Madigan, or Alexi Giannoulais is on board with anything he is proposing - we'll listen.
Until then, endure the barbs - today your running mate shows leadership regarding our electric rates and looks like he is willing to lead while you are not.
Listen to us and step away from your pulpit.
Little Egypt
· 2 years ago
The title of this thought-provoking original post from Rich was "Chill, please". Jeeze, I'd hate to see what would have been written if he hadn't asked for civilized conduct here today. There have been a lot of good comments posted. It's too bad that someone can't force Blago to sit down and read this stuff. It's good. It's all good - both pro and con. I do think the posters here would make a better cabinet for this guy than the ones he has. I'd love to see Bill, Schnorf, and YDD, just to name a few, on that cabinet because something good would come out of it.
Bill
· 2 years ago
There are numerous Senate and House members who support the Governor's plan. The mayor of Chicago is also interested in the revenue the GRT will provide for education,transportation, and property tax relief. There is just one "leader" who refuses to discuss the plan and negotiate and he wants his coffee right anow, YLDD, and don't forget to empty the waste basket on your way out.
leigh
· 2 years ago
Cut spending and stop trying to add new programs. Close the loopholes in the corporate tax laws. Start a graduated income tax, having those who have the most pay a little more, those with little to nothing pay less. It's not rocket science, it's common sense.
steven
· 2 years ago
So, leigh, are you leading the signature drive for the constitutional amendment to create a graduated income tax?
If not, you have about a quarter of a million to go...
Disgusted
· 2 years ago
Leigh: Amen, amen and AMEN!!! Add to that the fact that programs should be thought through to avoid duplication. We have All Kids, Healthy Women, Family Care, Mother and Child Care. Why all these separate programs when universal health care seems to be on the table? Why not just do that first and avoid the ridiculous costs of inaugurating each new program, something I deal with each and every working day.
Roman girl
· 2 years ago
three years ago when there were several initiatives to close corporate loopholes some went through but there were enough of the same groups that are the most vocal now urging everyone to break out the Depends or move out of state to put the kabosh on alot of them. And I'm grateful that the blogmaster has blasted the diatribes. This should be a thoughtful forum.
Give me a break
· 2 years ago
Give me a break Rich. You did drink the Kool Aid. You feel sorry for the guy because you bought into his magic show as you spent a week with him on the bus? Deep down you know that it is not the right course for the State and JBT would have come up with better ideas to handle the situation without screwing the entire citiizentry of Illinois. Get back to your initial gut feelings. The people of Illinois deserve nothing less.
NIEVA
· 2 years ago
Rich, you call some of this talk hate,I call it fear. When you put your 25 years in a job and look foreward to retirement and you see a spend and tax Chicago Democrat like Rod in charge of a state that has high debt,unpaid bills,pension debt and plans to increase spending without paying down these bills,call me hateful but I am scared!!
Dan Johnson-Weinberger
· 2 years ago
Steven and Leigh: there are already constitutional amendments filed to get rid of the provision that requires a Steve Forbes-style flat tax. Check out SJRCA 7 (Sandoval-Frerichs) and HJRCA 23 (Will Davis). They can use more co-sponsors. If the General Assembly pass these bills, they will appear on the November 2008 ballot for voters to approve or reject.
mean people suck
· 2 years ago
Rich, on or off the bus, your comments are on target. As for the Governor, the good news is that the people of Illinois have twice elected a man that prefers doing the right thing over back slapping his way to popularity. As Daley the first would have said of Blago's critics "what trees do they plant? where are their programs?"
State of Farce
· 2 years ago
Rich - you have to realize that this Governor came out of the gate right after his first election alienating just about everyone. No one likes him, except maybe his staff. He is the worst thing that has happened to this state in years and is taking us down the tubes. He only won the last election because Judy ran a terrible election and not enough conservative Republicans supported her. He outgunned her money-wise and Illinois apparently wasn't "ready" for a woman governor, especially a brazen, out-spoken woman. Its your blog, but we have had ENOUGH of this clown! I, for one think an indictment is coming. And, not soon enough. No more business as usual, eh? He hasn't cleaned up corruption and is ruining this state for business and the rest of us. Surely you agree....
Animous
· 2 years ago
Rich,
A little off-topic, but I think one underlying concern of a number of posters about the bus trip "Kool-Aid" is this: Blago is a lot of things but impersonal isn't one of them.
He has "converted" a number of (former) media members who opposed him over to the "dark" side by turning them into talking heads for the administration merely by spending time with them.
I can think of a few, but most notably in SPFLD is Rebecca Roush. She was fairly objective but critical, then low and behold she gets an "exclusive" interview with the GOV on a state plane (that she turned into a weeklong series in which she was absolutely giddy), then surprise, surprise she becomes a member of Team Blago a couple of weeks later.
We just don't want to see it happen again. You and your site have been a light in the darkness to a LOT of people that have seen a lot of things. We're just worried...
Keep up the good work.
Thanks...
Truthful James
· 2 years ago
Rich --
I have spoken out against 750 from the time that Martire was referring with Winkel as a pure tax swap. That was what they originally proposed, and it took some analysis to show that it was a tax taking. And I have been against the GRT since the beginning.
The reporters in Springfield and in Chicago (or perhaps their editors and producers) have hardly ever called atention to the split the swag method of budgeting in Springfield.
Generally, they appear to be awfully glad to listen and report without comment what comes out of the mouths of the legislature and the governor's office. They are not the eyes and ears of the people.
The whole process in Springfield is designed to mop up the huge windfalls that come in and wring them into the pork buckets and other containers.
The Illinois taxpayer needs to be informed of what is happening on the Revenue side of the equation. Perhaps the editors and producers think that we are not interested. We are.
How much more sales and income tax revenue has been generated for the Blago coffers since his first election. How many appropriation bills are written outside of the budget to take advantage of this largesse.
The attitude in Springfield is ...the public be damned, we need more money
Bill, there is not a structural deficit -- except in the pension area and that is partly due to the over-generous arrangements made with the teachers and other State employees.
In this Blog I have asked if there was any waste in State government spending. From the lack of response, not a penny. I am awestruck by the efficiency of Blago, Madigan and Jones. Not.
I ask a second question...show me all these corporate loopholes to which everybody blithely refers. Indeed, if they are there and they adversely affect the total revenues available to Illinois taxing bodies, then close them. But instead of blathering, which we all tend to do, let's look at the net effect of these loopholes not only on income tax receipts but also on other revenues to state and local governments caused by the use of the revenues not taxed.
Before we refer to a structural deficit, let's account for the waste.
Bill
· 2 years ago
Truthful, Once again you are not being very truthful. The truth is that Illinois pensions are NOT overly generous. In fact, they rank is the middle of the pack when compared to other states. The state has repeatedly, through the last six decades unerfunded the plans. Had state employees been covered under the social security system with no state pension the state would have had to pay MORE to the federal government then they have put into the pension plans.The federal gov't would not allow Illinois to institute a "holiday" when they wanted to spend the money elsewhere. There IS a structural deficit.Revenue growth will not keep up with state spending obligations even with no new, innovative spending for education and social programs. One way to solve the problem, I suppose, would be to change the structure. Illinois could offer no services, have no state employees, and not support education or health care or public safety for its residents. Would anyone live here then? Would it be good for business,then? Obviously not! Our politicians have been less than courageous in addressing our state's fiscal problems. The Governor is committed to changing that. It is time to pony up. Is there a certain amount of waste? Probably, as there is in all organizations. Can we cut our way out of our problems?...No!
312
· 2 years ago
Hmmmm... "numerous Senate and House members who support the Governor’s plan"
Sorry Bill, but from the sounds of things, "a couple" sounds more like it.
Who's gone on record so far to say they support it? Boland, Jones, Ronen... who else? I'd be VERY curious to know who these "numerous" legislators are.
If the guv's office is serious about the GRT passing (that this isn't just an extended press conference) then they would have started lining up their ducks.
Or is this another one of GRod's stunts to make himself look like an alleged HERO to the public because the mean old General Assembly won't "Put People First?"
I know where my $$$ is...
AND --- Rich, I agree the gov won't be convicted by the end of this term, but I'm hard pressed to believe he won't be indicted by 2009.
Yellow Dog Democrat
· 2 years ago
Bill -- please tell us who the "numerous" rank-and-file members are of the General Assembly who support the Governor's Gross Receipts Tax? According to backers of the bill, they've only identified six hard yeses in support, and two of those are Sen. Ronen and President Jones.
Granted, there are seven co-sponsors of SB 1 listed on the GA website, but those members all joined back when they thought that SB 1 would be a tax swap bill, not a GRT -- Sen. Meeks, for example.
Papa Legba
· 2 years ago
Bill is not answering our questions. It is hard to dispel the truth with a simple spin when the questions are presented in plain language.
All Comments
Good reminder for posts about these subjects, i.e. GRT and HB 750, and all subjects. These are complicated proposals and a big benefit of this and other blogs is the ability for experts to explain, analyze and offer opinions about these big ideas. However, sometimes folks let their passions for the players overwhelm the discussion.
One more thing: care to ask the Governor if he has a Question of the Day he'd like to ask ?
Why has there not been much talk about amending the constitution to make the income tax progressive? Also, there hasn't been much talk about Quinn’s initiative which could possibly bring in $2 billion a year. Maybe it’s goofy I don’t know, but can we modify it to make it work? I’m adamantly for closing corporate loops holes on truly big businesses but it’s important to remember that a small business can still bring in gross revenue of $15 - $20 million a year; it just depends on the industry.
Also, here is a thought about increasing revenue for the state; create a jobs program. Lets get people good paying jobs with benefits. It’s obviously hard to do, but if the governor would sit down with business and labor groups and work something out together it might happen. Here’s a first step, a transportation bill and $250 million isn’t enough.
The basic outrage is Governor I'm Anti-Tax and Governor I'm Going to Protect You Poor Taxpayers At All Costs just elect me over that Tax Happy Topinka and everything will be fine and dandy Blagojevich immediately after the election proposes and campaigns for the largest tax increase in Illinois history? Quibble away over who pays and who doesn't and what the hidden cost to everyone is and simply ask: WHAT WAS HE THINKING?
All those Democrats in my Lake County who were elected to go to Springfield on a platform of fiscal conservatism and anti-taxation. Not a peep from a single one of them since the Governor made his proposal! And with the Wisconsin border just a few minutes away . . . . . . . . . . . . . .
Bravo on a heartfelt blog. However, it undermines your credibility when you say you've been tougher on the governor than anybody else. You'd do well to follow your own advice here and not get overly emotional about your subject matter.
Rod took over and indeed tried creative things to make ends meet. He froze hiring and he looked like he would make tough decisions. But he didn't stick with it. He started going shopping. He increased our budget by a billion a year, instead of trying to keep spending down. He paid for his shopping trips with creative accounting and deficit spending. We all recognized the Christmas shopping and overspending he was doing. We knew he was cooking the books and waiting for our economy to pay off his bills. As he was doing all of this, he was losing support from fiscal conservatives and independants who were willing to let his shop and spend, but not very please with what they were also seeing - important medical bills going unpaid, pension payments going unpaid, and a stagnant job market while neighboring states grew at our expense. Blagojevich looked like he was too busy fiddling around and no longer looked serious.
Now this! It is like a mask fell from his face, and with his reelection, we are seeing just another 'tax and spender'. He knows he wasn't elected to play this game. He was elected to reform government, not expand it by 30%.
We haven't forgotten what we wanted to see five years ago. We wanted a reformed, efficient state government. We wanted a governor who counted every penny and spent wisely. Rod Blagojevich didn't deliver what he promised us.
He is on a bus, selling us a self-promoted legacy. It has no support from his running mate, his comptroller, his treasurer, the majority of Illinois businesses, or the majority of Illinois voters. He wants 7-8+ BILLION tax dollars. Yet he hasn't shown that he has balanced our budget, made our government more efficient, reformed our government, changed the way we do business, or anything he promised when he was first elected.
He had respect. He lost it. This bus trip didn't help him regain it. My advice is for him to sit down with the other adults in charge of our state and do another tour where he shows what he has accomplished with the money he gets annually. Then ask for more. His lack of humility behind pulpits and his 'god-talk' needs to be forgotten before he can expect anything more from us.
I was doing gov’t affairs for one of the larger local chambers of commerce here in IL a few years ago when 750 first became an issue (I have since moved on to other work). We did a few calls-to-action and wrote some letters, but not much more because (1) it never really made it onto the front burner and (2) the governor promised to veto it anyway - as he had promised he would do to any increases in his 2002 campaign.
Why is the rhetoric more heated and urgent in opposition to the GRT? Well, for starters, it’s because this is THE front burner issue, because the Governor (who is breaking both his 2002 & 2006 campaign pledges to not raise taxes) is essentially holding everyone else’s issues and agenda hostage until he gets this passed….a tactic never employed by the backers of 750.
Obviously, the hair-brained comments about you “drinking the kool-aide†are ridiculous and out of line. But I think the Governor deserves every bit of vitriol that comes his way on this bus tour.
Would he have won if he had let voters know this was on his mind?
Topinka suggested some alternatives and went agains much of her party over gambling. You wrote favorably of her for it Rich.
The Gov had to have been hiding this behemoth and I think Illinoisians right to resent him springing it on us.
Does more funding for education equate to better education? From the strong support of teacher organizations for either 750 or the GRT, I suspect it at least means higher teacher salaries. Do higher teacher salaries mean better education?
Rich,
I'm not sure how anyone could honestly think you'd drank the Blago-Aid.
And stop smashing my dreams of a conviction.
-- SCAM
We're not against you Rich. We are definitely for you. My problem with this whole GRT thing is why can't this governor, past governors and future governors forget their own agenda for their first 4 years and simply pay the State's past due bills? Is that really asking too much? Why can't they put this State on a solid financial footing before proposing more programs and then floating a tax to pay for them? I'm not against more funding for schools. I'm not against health insurance for the uninsured. In a perfect world, we would fund education fairly in all school districts and everyone would have the health insurance coverage they need and should have. But this is not a perfect world and this state is in hock up to its eyebrows. I know Blago would like to have a legacy of taking care of children - from their educational needs to their healthcare needs. I know he wants to be known as the governor who has helped families the most. What he's going to be known for is the same ol' same ol' - a governor who doesn't address the debt of this state and puts forth his own agenda, placing further debt upon all of us.
...'cause it's people who pay taxes and they can't pay if they're broke without jobs.
The Gov is going to give us a reverse Laffer curve; suck capital out of the enconomy with GRT, destroy jobs, reduce tax revenue... until Illini, like my Dutch cousins, find themselves emigrating from the welfare state.
Elected officials are paid and paid well to deal with every day issues. They hold high positions and get to tell the rest of us what to do. Let's see a little bit of accountability and dialogue without all the partisanship. Is that really too much to ask?!
"I was meant to be raised on a farm. Isn't this nice?"
While I agree that lots of our fellow Bloggers are sometimes overzealous in thier hatred the above quote is one of the all too typical incredebly over the top fake and meaningless instances which have come to personify this administration.
now, the real problem is the spinless politicos of all stripes who refuse to acknolwedge that the state has not had a balanced budget for years, and their steadfast unwillingness to raise the $ to pay the bills.
Is this the best way? IMHO, probably not, but it is a recognition of the need to RAISE $
keep on keeping on bro
Your words were right on the mark. Taxes are always a hot button item and no matter how you slice it, folks get emotional about the potential of even more money coming out of their pockets when that money is rarely used in a reasonable and prudent manner.
But you have always taken a fair and unbiased point of view towards all issues and I know you will continue to do so. Thanks for giving us the insight to help make up our minds on the many issues that plague our state.
This state would not have a shortage of cash and would have more money to fund schools if new social programs were not created. Why won't anyone in the media ask if such a program is really necessary?
I think that the GRT is just plan bad for state, I dont think it will be applied to out of state companies in the same way as it will be to in-state companies and even it is the compounding effect will still leave in state companies at disadvantage compared to ones based out of state, it will hurt economic and employment growth and catch a lot of companies that are not "big business". Even if it only affects 15 percent of the businesses in the State, what percentage of the state employment and economy do you think those 15 percentage of business make up? I am going to bet its a pretty big percentage and included most of the companies that consumers deal with on day to day bases.
All this being said, I agree that the state needs to close up the tax loop holes so that larger companies do pay their share of the corporate income tax.
Putting this aside, most criticisms of the GRT I have read in my infrequent musings of posts here have dwelled mostly on the pros or cons of the GRT itself. I do not think that bias against Blagojevich played a significant role in the evaluations of the proposal itself. The manner in which it was presented by villifying targets of the GRT tax certainly did not help with moving the proposal through a reasoned process of deliberation and debate. No matter what the intentions, some wounds are self inflicted.
Since you have the Governor’s ear, why don't ask the governor how he saved The State of Illinois money by eliminating my single position and replaced me with 5 people who weren't even qualified? Let's do the math, round numbers to keep it simple, let's say I was making $50k +benefits, then governor and/or his administration hires 5 people to replace me at $35K +benefits. That's $175K per year +benefits. That's $125K he's spending beyond what my salary was. How does that SAVE the state money?
I was exemplary state employee with an excellent work record.
But this is how our Governor rewards hardworking state employees.
Oh, by the way, my family and I haven't had health insurance for 4 years.
Also the us vs. them thing on the GRT kinds of gets under my skin. It is too easy to make business a hobgoblin.
Heck the health care thing is a noble cause, part of me thinks if it is that important then everyone should help pay for it.
OneMan
yuk,yuk,yuk,yuk,yuk,yuk,yuk,yuk,yuk,yuk,yuk,yuk,
yuk,yuk,yuk,yuk. The Gov must be a hoot!
From a marketer's perspective, those areas are tapped. Expanding multi-state options (like PowerBall and MegaMillions) has actually shown to attract more lottery buyers from middle and working class folk. More excitement and higher dollar amounts lead to a broader base of customers.
This would most likely be the same thing that would happen here in Illinois.
Think about it - If Powerball and MegaMillions merge (and reduce the odds), there could possibly be a $1 billion lottery jackpot in our lifetimes.
Millionaires would be playing that game...
Just a thought.
Catch your breath. The Governor has solidly been against HB750, as have many in the GA. Most seem to think HB750 is a non-issue. If the liklihood of 750 getting passed increases, you will no doubt see a bunch of postings on it.
Since you are on the bus with him, can you ask the governor if he can write a special exemption in the GRT for capitol fax? :-)
You are probably right on the market expansion. Yes, when the pot goes up everyone gets in, but what I spend in a month on such things is less then what I spend on fancy coffee drinks in a week, I can afford to do that, it doesn't significantly impact my kid's college fund. What I see in places that need that money is the opposite. It sells false hope. What's worse is this admin wants to sell it off to privitize to increase the market of selling false hope. Hard to connect that with wanting to serve all the children and give everyone universal health care. But then again they haven't exactly been out infront of trying to bring costs down by mal-practice reform. They pick and choose.
Sure most do, but don't attempt to stake the moral high ground when you aren't leading the charge in places that really have impact to the State.
1. The state's individual income tax is already regressive in that low income folks feel its effects more than people on the higher end of the socio-economic ladder. Hiking the rates from 3 percent to 5 percent would only make things worse.
2. One of the "perks" for tax payers is supposedly that property owners would get some cut in their income taxes. That's a nice concept, but this plan is again regressive in that low-income and young people seldom own homes.
3. Does anybody honestly think that local governments won't jack property taxes back up again after HB 750 reduces them?
Many states have actually cut taxes over the past few years in part to attract businesses, new jobs, and new sources of tax revenue. We, on the other hand, are running in the opposite direction. Sadly, the folks in the state capital seem to never find a spending proposal they don't like. If this weren't the case, we could perhaps be like other states and be talking about whether and to what extent we should cut taxes.
750 may look attractive when compared to the GRT, but it's still like jumping off the top of a twenty story building as opposed to a forty.
personally, I think you allow too much (anonymous) ranting on most topics on the site, but it's your site.
Illinois conducts itself. Each time, he has endured personal criticism and his proposals have been met with derision. Pre-school,Allkids, cutting the bloated state workforce,Keno, leasing the tollway, selling the lotttery, pension reform, capital bonds, pension bonds,universal health insurance, etc..These were new and innovative ideas that prompted intense criticism. However, throughout all of the criticism, no alternative plans to solve the problems were suggested by his critics. It is easy to criticize, slander, and make fun. It is not so easy to suggest viable alternatives. ( I don't consider closing the public schools, abolishing the property tax, reneging on pensions, etc. viable),
Throughout his tenure, the Gov. has courageously stuck to his pledge to change business as usual in Illinois. He keeps trying to come up with policies and programs that he feels will improve people's quality of life. Things will be a lot different after this session then they were previously. We will have the Governor to thank (or blame).
I always felt that during the camapign, Rich went out of his way to blast Rod. Remember OY! and reform and renewal #1,987,654? It was obvious to me that he wanted his good friend Judy to win. Now, after the election, he is showing his maturity and professionalism as a journalist by avioding the "I hate Rod" trap and reporting fairly and accurately on the issues.
In reality, the Governor is a good guy trying to do the right thing. You may not agree with his methods or his policies. If you don't, come up with some constructive viuable, alternatives instead of the barrage of juvenile taunts and insults. Blagojevich pictures himself as the little guy's champion. So do I.
Pass the Kool Aid. It tastes great to me.
I think the raucous opposition from the governor is driven by two factors.
First, policy:
The Civic Committee, representing the largest business interests in Illinois, endorsed the very same income tax increases outlined in HB 750, so you can hardly portray that portion of HB 750 as being anti-business. And the Taxpayers Federation, in committee testimony, acknowledged the need to establish a service tax in Illinois, as well as the fact that surrounding states also tax these same services. So there is no business argument that folks are suddenly going going to be driving to Missouri to get their hair cut, because Missouri and all neighboring states tax hair cuts.
Secondly, we can't ignore the fact that the GRT is a much bigger net tax increase than HB 750. Nor that most of the spending in the Governor's plan will be diverted to other things besides education -- which poll after poll has solidly identified as the top priority of voters. So, whether you call the Gov's spending proposal "pork", or some other name, its in there.
Secondly, process:
Whether the Governor hastily through together his plan after the election, or has always been planning on a GRT and just hid that fact from voters, the way he's advanced his plan is screwy. Call him confrontational, adversarial, manipulative, deceptive, all of the adjectives fit.
In addition, his rhetoric doesn't match the reality of his proposal. The Governor's attack on HB 750 is that he won't raise taxes on working people. Bu even his budget director admits that it's atleast possible that the GRT will be passed on to consumers. Economic experts are saying its a given, backed up by projections from the Illinois Petroleum Marketers Association that the price of gasoline will rise 4 to 10 cents, reports that groceries and prescription drugs will see an increase in prices due to the GRT, and numerous other sources. You see that reflected in the poll results you've reported here, that the majority of voters believe the Governor has broken his promise not to raise income or sales taxes. Granted, he's found a sly way of doing it, but voters resent being played for a fool even more than they resent taxes.
I predicted a long time ago that the Governor would break all of his campaign promises, except his promise not to raise taxes, and that one day he would do that. That day is here, and now the choice for the Governor is simple: do I continue to fight against leaders from my own party and push my tax increase plan, which only one-third of Illinoisans support? Or do I work with all of the leaders from my own party to fine tune a plan that has been around for 20+ years and which the majority of Illinois supports?
The old saying goes "There's no limit to what you can accomplish if you don't care who gets the credit."
The Blagojevich Corollary is "You can't expect to accomplish much if you adopt a 'My way or the highway' attitude and insist on getting all the credit."
Then again, maybe accomplishing very little while making a lot of noise (we used to call it 'imitating work') is what the Governor had in mind all along.
Governor Blaogjevich ESCALATED "Business as Usual". Rod needs to resign before he causes Illinois anymore embarassment.
"Tribune bosses' big paydays:
Executives will rake in cash while workers take risk, company goes further into debt"
http://www.suntimes.com/news/metro/325896,CST-N...
I wish I didn't have to pay taxes, I could be just like the Tribune, too!
Ask the Gov what is "Fair Share"
Would he have won if he had let voters know this was on his mind?
Sure. In a normal election year maybe not. Against a functioning state Republican party, it would've been dicier. But as a Dem running in 2006 in this state he was in as good a shape as a politician can possibly be.
I've always been a supporter of HB 750, so please stop your ignorant personal attacks.
When I say that the Governor isn't working with leaders of his own party, I'm referring to the Chairman of the Democratic Party/Speaker of the Illinois House, State Treasurer, State Comptroller, Lt. Governor, and Mayor of Chicago, all of whom have expressed grave concerns regarding or direct opposition to the Governor's plan. Other than the Senate President, who has relegated himself to the position of the Governor's Yes Man, I'm unaware of any elected leader in Illinois except State Rep. Mike Boland that has publicly supported the Governor's Gross Receipts Tax. Not even the Democratic County Chairmen with family members on the Governor's payroll are publicly backing his plan as written. If I'm wrong, please tell me.
And Bill, Emil does not have a vision and does not really care about "the little people". Look at his D-2s and tell me otherwise. He wants money for schools so that the IFT and IEA can keep pumping his slush funds full of cash, and he won't touch the electric rate issue. That is not leadership; that is greed. MJM, for all of his faults, seems more concerned about balancing the budget and restoring normalcy to the governing process.
I think tangent rants are great for this website. It keeps everyone interested and makes for some great conversation.
But, let's be honest here. If the Governor had said BEFORE the election that he believes Illinois needs to increase taxes by $8-9 billion to expand services, then we would have had a referendum on that question. But, he campaigned on the lie that he was opposed to higher taxes and did not deal with the issue honestly.
Even now, the Governor doesn't really want to put the question to the public. A Gross Receipts Tax is bad public policy in part because it hides the true cost of government from the taxpayers. Despite the Governor's childish, over-the-top class warfare language, not one "evil corporation" will pay the tax, they'll just collect them.
I don't support HB 750, but at least it is fairly straightforward.
If we really need to expand services, provide universal healthcare and substantially increase education spending, why not tell the public honestly and truthfully what the cost of those service expansions will be?
Is it that we are afraid that once they know how much it will cost them, they'll decide it's not worth the money?
Everyday, consumers make decisons about the value and cost of goods on both small and large items: Is it worth an extra 50 cents to buy Cheerios instead of "Oaty Oats?" Is it worth it to buy the 2007 model or can I keep the old car going for awhile longer?
Why is it that liberals -- and a fair number of conservatives -- refuse to trust these same people to be responsible consumers of government.
In one way, both George Bush and Rod Blagojevich are exactly the same -- they have tried to hide the true cost of government from the people by spending more than we take in and passing the cost onto future generations. (And, now, Blagojevich wants to hide billions in taxes from the public by pretending it's a tax on "business."
If it is "reactionary" to let the taxpayers decide how they want their tax dollars spent, then I'm proud to be called a reactionary.
Here's a simple reason nobody talks about spending cuts, efficiency, etc. First, think about the cumulative lobbying power of those who support education, health care, and human services. Now, look at the budget request for '08:
Total GF budget: $28.86 Billion
Educ. - 39.4%
Healthcare and families - 29.7%
Human Svcs. - 20.4%
All 3 - 89.5% or $25.8 Billion
Simple calculation shows just over $3 Billion is left for EVERYTHING else. Wipe out all other state GF spending (including the elected officials) and there's barely enough to pay the pension debt.
Wanna cut spending? You must cut education, health care and human services......
You bring up these topics and say we just rip on Blago for any idea he comes up with. Here are some short answers for you.
Pre-school – No funding mechanism, reduces existing state revenues. A feel good Sunday press release.
Allkids – Can’t pay our outstanding medical bills now, no funding mechanism, reduces existing state revenues, no doctors want any part or it. A feel good Sunday press release.
Cutting the bloated state workforce – Shove old time, front line workers out the door and replace them with inexperienced, massively over-paid political hacks. Hide “employees†by using contracts.
Keno – DOA and pie-in-the-sky fantasy.
Leasing the tollway – Can we lease what we don’t own? The original bonds still haven’t been paid off.
Selling the lottery – Short-term cash infusion with nothing to replace revenue currently generated by the Lotto.
Pension reform – Nothing yet. Just a sound good, sound bite.
Capital bonds – Like Illinois needs more debt. Try reducing spending instead.
Pension bonds – Did that once. Where did the money go? Why is the pension still hugely under funded?
Universal health insurance – Feel good Sunday press release. No funding mechanism, reduces existing state revenues.
Why should we back these ideas when the are not sound plans and have no details?
Until then, endure the barbs - today your running mate shows leadership regarding our electric rates and looks like he is willing to lead while you are not.
Listen to us and step away from your pulpit.
If not, you have about a quarter of a million to go...
And I'm grateful that the blogmaster has blasted the diatribes. This should be a thoughtful forum.
A little off-topic, but I think one underlying concern of a number of posters about the bus trip "Kool-Aid" is this: Blago is a lot of things but impersonal isn't one of them.
He has "converted" a number of (former) media members who opposed him over to the "dark" side by turning them into talking heads for the administration merely by spending time with them.
I can think of a few, but most notably in SPFLD is Rebecca Roush. She was fairly objective but critical, then low and behold she gets an "exclusive" interview with the GOV on a state plane (that she turned into a weeklong series in which she was absolutely giddy), then surprise, surprise she becomes a member of Team Blago a couple of weeks later.
We just don't want to see it happen again. You and your site have been a light in the darkness to a LOT of people that have seen a lot of things. We're just worried...
Keep up the good work.
Thanks...
I have spoken out against 750 from the time that Martire was referring with Winkel as a pure tax swap. That was what they originally proposed, and it took some analysis to show that it was a tax taking. And I have been against the GRT since the beginning.
The reporters in Springfield and in Chicago (or perhaps their editors and producers) have hardly ever called atention to the split the swag method of budgeting in Springfield.
Generally, they appear to be awfully glad to listen and report without comment what comes out of the mouths of the legislature and the governor's office. They are not the eyes and ears of the people.
The whole process in Springfield is designed to mop up the huge windfalls that come in and wring them into the pork buckets and other containers.
The Illinois taxpayer needs to be informed of what is happening on the Revenue side of the equation. Perhaps the editors and producers think that we are not interested. We are.
How much more sales and income tax revenue has been generated for the Blago coffers since his first election. How many appropriation bills are written outside of the budget to take advantage of this largesse.
The attitude in Springfield is ...the public be damned, we need more money
Bill, there is not a structural deficit -- except in the pension area and that is partly due to the over-generous arrangements made with the teachers and other State employees.
In this Blog I have asked if there was any waste in State government spending. From the lack of response, not a penny. I am awestruck by the efficiency of Blago, Madigan and Jones. Not.
I ask a second question...show me all these corporate loopholes to which everybody blithely refers. Indeed, if they are there and they adversely affect the total revenues available to Illinois taxing bodies, then close them. But instead of blathering, which we all tend to do, let's look at the net effect of these loopholes not only on income tax receipts but also on other revenues to state and local governments caused by the use of the revenues not taxed.
Before we refer to a structural deficit, let's account for the waste.
Once again you are not being very truthful. The truth is that Illinois pensions are NOT overly generous. In fact, they rank is the middle of the pack when compared to other states. The state has repeatedly, through the last six decades unerfunded the plans. Had state employees been covered under the social security system with no state pension the state would have had to pay MORE to the federal government then they have put into the pension plans.The federal gov't would not allow Illinois to institute a "holiday" when they wanted to spend the money elsewhere. There IS a structural deficit.Revenue growth will not keep up with state spending obligations even with no new, innovative spending for education and social programs. One way to solve the problem, I suppose, would be to change the structure. Illinois could offer no services, have no state employees, and not support education or health care or public safety for its residents.
Would anyone live here then? Would it be good for business,then? Obviously not!
Our politicians have been less than courageous in addressing our state's fiscal problems. The Governor is committed to changing that. It is time to pony up. Is there a certain amount of waste? Probably, as there is in all organizations. Can we cut our way out of our problems?...No!
Sorry Bill, but from the sounds of things, "a couple" sounds more like it.
Who's gone on record so far to say they support it? Boland, Jones, Ronen... who else? I'd be VERY curious to know who these "numerous" legislators are.
If the guv's office is serious about the GRT passing (that this isn't just an extended press conference) then they would have started lining up their ducks.
Or is this another one of GRod's stunts to make himself look like an alleged HERO to the public because the mean old General Assembly won't "Put People First?"
I know where my $$$ is...
AND --- Rich, I agree the gov won't be convicted by the end of this term, but I'm hard pressed to believe he won't be indicted by 2009.
Granted, there are seven co-sponsors of SB 1 listed on the GA website, but those members all joined back when they thought that SB 1 would be a tax swap bill, not a GRT -- Sen. Meeks, for example.