CapitolFax.com - Latest Comments in Question of the day – Tavern gambling

Re: Question of the day – Tavern gambling

Reformed — Thu, 06 Dec 2007 22:42:51 -0000

It should be legalized but with strict limits on how much an individual can bet. I have a relative who lost his arse playing video poker at the local Knights of Columbus. He went bankrupt becaue of his addiction and the greed of the good Catholic boys. They were cashing 5-6 $100 checks for him in a day.
Legalize it to control it.

Re: Question of the day – Tavern gambling

CAsablanca-6500 — Thu, 06 Dec 2007 22:08:13 -0000

And please do not forget former Cook County Sheriff Dick Ogilvie's involvement with these machines.

Re: Question of the day – Tavern gambling

CAsablanca-6500 — Thu, 06 Dec 2007 22:05:23 -0000

What makes anyone here think that legalizing these games will cut out the outfit entirely?

Re: Question of the day – Tavern gambling

NoGiftsPlease — Thu, 06 Dec 2007 20:31:30 -0000

No, I never played one and I'm not interested in gambling. As far as I can tell, having legalized gambling on riverboat casinos simply ensures that the money is funded to wealthy investors instead of neighborhood pub owners. I think gambling is stupid and I don't understand how people can be entertained by it, but if it is legal for horse racing and on riverboats (what about all that off-track betting, what's the difference with that?)I say spread the wealth around. Don't make it just a way for the rich to get richer.

Re: Question of the day – Tavern gambling

NIEVA — Thu, 06 Dec 2007 18:32:39 -0000

They are found in almost every tavern in Southern Il. I even know of one in a gas station,backroom of course! Most will tell you that their profit is made from the machines.

Re: Question of the day – Tavern gambling

Rich Miller — Thu, 06 Dec 2007 18:17:22 -0000

Also, FYI, I may have played a tavern machine once or twice, but I've never cashed out.

Re: Question of the day – Tavern gambling

Rich Miller — Thu, 06 Dec 2007 18:15:30 -0000

I walked into a tavern years ago just after a state cop (now retired) had hit a Royal Flush.

Since I was broke in those days, I ordered a draft beer. The bartender said it was free. All drinks would be free as long as the cop was still in the bar because he was spending his winnings on drinks for us lucky duckies.

I immediately switched to top shelf.

Fun night. What I remember of it.

Re: Question of the day – Tavern gambling

lake county democrat — Thu, 06 Dec 2007 18:06:32 -0000

Haven't played it. Don't know if it should be legal: seems like if you allow everyone to set up gambling down the block it can undercut the casinos and kill the golden goose. But I can see the argument that it helps stop lost revenue too, so...

Re: Question of the day – Tavern gambling

Truthful James — Thu, 06 Dec 2007 17:44:08 -0000

SCAM -- These are games of amusement, not games of chance, never forget that.

Second, it is not illegal to play them, it is not illegal to lose your money, it is not illegal to get credits on the gaming screen. For all I know, it is not illegal to stand by the machine and have a player put a coin in your hand and pull the handle (reducing the credit by one on each pull). However, it may be illegal to pay him if that player increases the number of credits. It is illegal if you ask the bartender to pay you back for the credits on the machine, even if they are less than or exactly equal to the coins you have put into the machine.

No matter how long you stare at it, the machine will not pay out any coins.

If you are known at the bar, you may get a payout if you follow proper etiquette. Do not shout out and dance, drawing the attention of everybody in the tavern to your skill and good fortune; there are devils everywhere. Quietly station a friend by the machine (so nobody plays off or uses your credits), sidle up to the bartender/manager, and tell him quietly to take a look at your machine. He will need his special key to run off thr credits. Go sit at the end of the bar. When he comes back, order a drink. When the time is right and the bartender/manager feels safe you will get paid.

Re: Question of the day – Tavern gambling

L.S. — Thu, 06 Dec 2007 17:31:41 -0000

I like Tom Dart, but come on. How bad of a gambling addict do you have to be to lose $60k on a bar poker machine? Do we really think taking the machines away will stop that guy from gambling??? If anything, the bar should refuse him as a customer and not pay out to him, just as they're not supposed to serve an obvious drunk. This is nothing more than a law enforcement offical trying to get headlines by "cracking down" on something that doesn't really need to be crackd down on.

Re: Question of the day – Tavern gambling

so-called "Austin Mayor" — Thu, 06 Dec 2007 16:29:14 -0000

I have never played illegal games of chance because I have no idea what the process is, i.e. how do you ask for a payout without looking like a rube or a narc?

Am I over thinking this?

Could some video poker vet clue me in?

-- SCAM

Re: Question of the day – Tavern gambling

Yellow Dog Democrat — Thu, 06 Dec 2007 16:05:15 -0000

P.S. Should have offered a Hat Tip to the Illinois Campaign for Political Reform's Sunshine Project,a handy searchable database.

Keep up the good work, guys.

Re: Question of the day – Tavern gambling

Yellow Dog Democrat — Thu, 06 Dec 2007 15:56:11 -0000

I'm old enough to remember when Cueto was arrested and jailed in Madison County for his involvement in illegal video poker machines. There were serious allegations of organized crime involvement at the time, from what I recall.

I'm not a regular at the types of taverns that have these machines, but I've been in them from time-to-time, and more importantly I know people who are addicted to them.

Look at the dull, listless faces at the folks who sit at these machines for hours on end and then tell me they should be legalized in every neighborhood in Illinois. I don't think so.

Gambling is a slippery slope for both gamblers and lawmakers. Once they start, its hard to stop. Let's face it, if the Governor had a shred of fiscal responsibility in his body, we wouldn't be even talking about expanding gambling today. And if the gambling industry were banned from making campaign contributions, we would have passed education funding reform in 2003.

But, as long as casinos can pad lawmakers pockets, many seem intent on driving our state's budget into the ditch, just so casinos can come to the rescue.

You can put Emil Jones in that camp. Until recently Emil was a champion of education funding reform, but Emil blocked education funding reform in 2007 and has pushed to expand gambling instead.

Top 50 contributors to Emil and the Senate Democrats in 2005-2006 include:

Arlington Race Track - $87,500
Casino Queen - $25,000
Churchill Downs Inc. - $25,000
Harrahs - $45,000
Penn National Gaming - $40,000

Re: Question of the day – Tavern gambling

to Carl — Thu, 06 Dec 2007 15:16:23 -0000

How did that answer the question? And no I haven't played video poker but yes they should legalize it. (I did answer the question) :)

Re: Question of the day – Tavern gambling

Yes — Thu, 06 Dec 2007 14:10:38 -0000

I say yes. I play the games. WHy not legalize. If not, don't you think Dart has better things to do?

Re: Question of the day – Tavern gambling

Carl Nyberg — Thu, 06 Dec 2007 14:04:08 -0000

Here's an insight about the Illinois smoking ban and private clubs.

If an establishment (bar/restaurant) wants to get around the smoking ban it can switch to being a private club.

Becoming a private club will cost the establishment business, but they can continue to have smoking.

If an establishment is already skirting the smoking ban, why not allow some gambling or bring in strippers a couple nights a month?

I see the smoking ban as having the unintended consequence of expanding informal gambling operations and part-time strip clubs.

Re: Question of the day – Tavern gambling

Muskrat — Thu, 06 Dec 2007 13:57:53 -0000

Never played video poker. No comment on whether I've played "closing time roulette," which was the first thing I thought of when I saw the headline.

Sure, legalize them.

Re: Question of the day – Tavern gambling

God's Country — Thu, 06 Dec 2007 13:48:47 -0000

Legalize it, tax it, set aside a portion of the taxes for gambling treatment programs/education.

Re: Question of the day – Tavern gambling

steve schnorf — Thu, 06 Dec 2007 13:23:06 -0000

Rich,
there might have been value in splitting the question. For example, yes I have played video poker machines (and other video games) at taverns, but no, I've never received a payout.

Re: Question of the day – Tavern gambling

The Horse — Thu, 06 Dec 2007 13:11:42 -0000

ditto james' comments.

But if you legalize them, you will need another gaming commission and the paperwork will be so onerous that they will go black market again...

Re: Question of the day – Tavern gambling

plutocrat03 — Thu, 06 Dec 2007 12:59:07 -0000

Here we go with mission creep again. But the same logic is there. Government needs revenue and people want to gamble, so where is the problem?

I will suspend my distaste for gambling for a moment and make a case for the small business owner. Why not try to keep the profits in the local neighborhood?

We can dispense with all kinds of insiders 'investing' and profiteering from the enterprise, local business will thrive rather than wither with the grand casino concepts, You can apply the same anti-Walmart arguements to keep the money local.

That all being said, the Federal Report on Gambling in thee mid-90s said we already have too many places to gamble. The means after more than 10 years of casino building, we really have too many places to gamble.

Lets suck it up and figure out how to run government more efficiently and live within our means. No new gambling licenses, take the idle one, get it to Chicago, make sure there are no private shareholders so all the profits go to the city and state. Learn to do what every manager in private industry has to do. Accomplish more with less each year.

Re: Question of the day – Tavern gambling

Greg — Thu, 06 Dec 2007 12:56:40 -0000

If you object on the basis that too many people waste their money on it, then let's disallow extended warranties, alcohol, and shorting GOOG.

Re: Question of the day – Tavern gambling

Greg — Thu, 06 Dec 2007 12:50:11 -0000

Bingo, rich. Everything about the history of gambling in this country suggests that organized crime is most compatible with illegal gambling, not legal.

I've said it before, but we make illegal political futures, with zero expected loss and real economic purpose, but allow lotteries with 1/3 expected losses.

Re: Question of the day – Tavern gambling

Sacks Romana — Thu, 06 Dec 2007 12:48:52 -0000

I guess I side with the Puritans on this one.

I like gambling. Playing poker with friends is a great night's worth of entertainment. We've organized Spades tournaments for money, and I know people who do the same for Bridge. Fantasty leagues, NCAA basketball brackets, great stuff.

But I hate casinos, slots, video poker, the lottery, etc. These aren't games of "chance." The expected value for the player in all of these things is negative. It's a mathematical certainty. And it simply preys on people (both poor and rich) that don't intuitively understand a statistical concept (or for that matter, a business concept). For all of these games, the more you play, the more you are guaranteed to lose. The tavern owners wouldn't have it any other way, same as the casino owners. Unless the tavern owner is giving you a refund when you've lost too much money on his game, he's not "taking care of his own."

I haven't witnessed payouts on pinball machines, but I enjoy playing those and Golden Tee and pool, and other games on their own merits. If me and my friends want to make a side bet, that's fun and fine. I'm not going to let my friend make a high enough bet in the first place to bankrupt him and destroy his life.

Video poker isn't anything like actual poker. Without payouts it's a waste of time, and with payouts, it's identical to a slot machine. And I don't think that should be legal.

Re: Question of the day – Tavern gambling

Rich Miller — Thu, 06 Dec 2007 12:41:21 -0000

===Remember this isnâ€™t the Boy Scouts running this racket.===

Except strict legalization would cut out the outfit.