CapitolFax.com - Latest Comments in Question of the day

Re: Question of the day

Rich Miller — Fri, 24 Apr 2009 00:05:31 -0000

=== And their patrons are not out of town tourists; they are poor, many of them are black, the working poor.===

What the heck does being black have to do with anything?

Re: Question of the day

Sandy Adell — Thu, 23 Apr 2009 23:37:04 -0000

After reading these posts, I was dismayed that so little was said about the negative impact casino gambling and the rapid expansion of casinos are having on vulnerable communities: the elderly, the disabled, and communities of color.

Most people in this country aren't interested in gambling at all and they believe the rhetoric of their local and state politicians, that casino gambling brings "economic development" to depressed communities.

People who don't gamble, including many of the politicians who propose casinos as a quick way to generate new revenue, don't see how pathetic the people inside the casinos are. They don't see the tragedies that are happening as a result of the close proximity of casinos to just about every body in the country.

After struggling for two years with an addiction to slot machine gambling, I can say with certainty that this is not just a matter of choice or personal responsibility. The space of the casino with rows and rows of slot machines, no clocks, and no daylight filtering in, is designed to induce a high state of overstimulation, to hook people, like myself, who might not otherwise engage in such potentially destructive activity.

I should mention also that the number of women becoming compulsive gamblers is growing by the year. And they are committing crimes in greater numbers to cover their debts.

As Professor Kindt and other highly respected economists, psychologists, and neuroscientists are showing, slot machine gambling is especially pernicious, but slot machines generate nearly seventy percent of all gambling revenue.

There is much talk these days about predatory sub-prime lenders, credit card lenders who charge outrageous fees and high interest rates, yet the casino owners and operators continue to rake in enormous profits, even during the recession.

Take a look at Detroit. It has three large casinos, each within 2.5 miles of each other. Greektown Casino has filed for bankruptcy, but it keeps right on operating. The other two casinos, MGM Grand and Motor City casino are in very devastated neighborhoods, where you can't even find a grocery store.

Those casinos haven't brought economic development to Detroit. I admit that they can't be blamed for the City's woes, but they aren't helping. And their patrons are not out of town tourists; they are poor, many of them are black, the working poor.

I don't know if it's possible to ban gambling, now that the floodgates are wide open, but we don't need any more casinos. I would call for a moratorium on casino expansion.

With regard to Professor Kindt and his work, there is nothing "kooky" about him. I admit that I'm biased. I recently wrote a book about my gambling experience and benefited greatly from Professor Kindt's studies.

They helped me understand the economics of casino gambling. I am also a professor. Although I teach literature, I know enough about scholarship to know that Professor Kindt work is thoughtful, rigorous, and carefully documented.

Re: Question of the day

joe sch — Thu, 23 Apr 2009 22:01:07 -0000

Rich Miller -- Your comment "Stupid" and "Bite Me" to my posting is too pedestrian to warrant a reply.

Re: Question of the day

Truthful James — Thu, 23 Apr 2009 09:12:40 -0000

There is a difference, Zato.

It relates to the multiplier, the number of times that rhe purchase of the good or service reverberates through the economy.

The retail purchase of goods results in the purchase of replacement goods to stock the shelves. This provides money which is spent on his business by the wholesaler or middle man. This is true of the ma and pa who buys through a local, Then the middleman pays his people and makes purchases of goods, some locally some from outside the state.

When you get to Wal Mart and target and the big boys, it remains to be seen where the middle man is located. This is especially the case where there are fewer producers or manufacturers in Illinois from which to purchase finished goods. Wal Mart just sends in container loads from depots elsewhere. I high percentage of goods sold there are produced overseas -- which cuts the U.S, economic multiplier.

But I digress, Gambling deals in cash. There is no middleman. The owners do not reinvest in the economy (except when the casino is locally owned. There is no tax on each sale (each pull of the slot machine is a sale) as there are at the cash registers at your neighborhood store, only a state tax on profits as well as the State fees. Therefore, by definition, unless the State take is a good approximation of the sales tax per transaction, the state may not be getting what would otherwise be generated. The local municipality benefits but only because of their location.

Location, location location, and those that don't have a casino (or a shopping mall with the sales tax distributions) lose out.

Re: Question of the day

Rich Miller — Thu, 23 Apr 2009 07:12:05 -0000

She's always welcome back. But she needs to realize that she can't just vent that way and not be challenged.

Re: Question of the day

Arthur Andersen — Thu, 23 Apr 2009 06:15:47 -0000

Rich, thanks for standing up for your regulars, even though we may not deserve it some days.
Ms. Gilroy cetainly filled her tinfoil hat during her inaugural visit to Captain's Quarters and likely won't be back for more.
Well done.

Re: Question of the day

dan l — Thu, 23 Apr 2009 00:41:15 -0000

Jesus.

Harry Hitzeman Daily Herald Staff Writer What do you get when you combine police, a golf outing and dancers? A complaint about an illegal raffle. Glendale Heights police are looking into whether to fine the Northlake Fraternal Order of Police for holding a charity raffle without a license during an Aug.

7 golf outing in the village. The department's inquiry came after Villa Park resident Kathy Gilroy, a volunteer with the Northern Illinois Anti-Gambling Task Force, complained that the FOP didn't have a raffle permit. Glendale Heights Village Clerk JoAnn Borysiewicz ...

http://findarticles.com/p/a...

Man oh man. Nobody let this woman come anywhere near your block party.

Re: Question of the day

dan l — Thu, 23 Apr 2009 00:32:47 -0000

Kathy,

Maybe you're right. Maybe this kindt fella is totally legitimate and he just randomly became a winger poster child. Totally possible. Unlikely, but possible.

But let me in on this, because you're clearly anti-gambling:

Do you really believe that the years of fiscal screw ups in this state could be resolved just by banning gambling?

Side note, for lulz:

Former Chicago Bears great Richard Dentâ€™s philanthropy, the Make a Dent Foundation, attempted to sell raffle tickets for the chance to win a $200,000 Bentley Continental GT. The proceeds of the raffle were to go towards scholarships for needy youths and research on Alzheimerâ€™s. Kathy Gilroy, a volunteer with the Northern Illinois anti-Gambling Task Force, who vigilance has earned her the moniker â€œraffle busterâ€, read about the raffle, checked with the Chicago Department of Revenue and determined that Dentâ€™s foundation did not have a license to run a raffle. She further pointed out that the foundation was violating the city raffle ordinance by charging $1,000 a ticket, five times the maximum of $200, and allowing purchases by credit card, rather than currency or check. Once notified, the charity obtained a license, proposed giving raffle ticket buyers the option of a refund or getting five chances at $200 each and halted ticket purchases by credit card.

http://www.winston.com/site...

Secret Message

Re: Question of the day

Rich Miller — Wed, 22 Apr 2009 23:33:57 -0000

To sum up joe sch's comment: Go team!

Stupid.

Bite me.

Re: Question of the day

joe sch — Wed, 22 Apr 2009 23:16:47 -0000

Rich Miller, shame on you for badmouthing Kathy's comments. Hers is the most intelligible of the whole bunch. I've heard Prof. Kindt speak a number of times and I've read most of his heavily annotated essays on the evils of gambling. He's the very best, as is Kathy. Joe S.

Re: Question of the day

johnbtes — Wed, 22 Apr 2009 22:25:32 -0000

One thing is for sure. Even if the study would prove to be true, it would be a very rough transition for the employees being laid off and the new revenue would not come quickly. It may or may not be true that this execution would work but the real problem would be on acquiring that available disposable income.

Re: Question of the day

Rich Miller — Wed, 22 Apr 2009 20:27:15 -0000

Kathy, in the future make your points without resorting to blanket condemnations of my commenters. That's a sure path to future deletions. The only really stupid comment here today was yours.

Re: Question of the day

wordslinger — Wed, 22 Apr 2009 20:18:54 -0000

Kathy, I was answering the original question regarding the merits of the study. I don't think banning casinos will fix the Illinois economy. I also don't believe that the state pays out $3 on gambling related problems for every $1 in gambling tax revenue it brings in.

I'm not a proponent of gambling. I've never been to an Illinois boat. My choice. I also didn't call anyone names.

The professor is obviously an anti-gambling cottage industry. Check google and you can read excerpts from "studies" where he claims gambling undermines national security and world peace. I doubt it. I'm sure he testifies before Congress because he's invited by committee members who agree with him. That's the way it usually goes.

If you're against gambling for whatever reasons, fine, it's a free country. But it's a constant battle in a free society as to what the state should ban for all because a small number can't handle it responsibly.

You know, for many, a casino is a lot like life: Sometimes you're up, sometimes you're down, and the house always wins in the end. Doesn't mean you didn't have a good time :)

Re: Question of the day

Cheswick — Wed, 22 Apr 2009 19:55:23 -0000

Hey, I'm no expert. I'm just a person with some life experience and an opinion.

It's my belief that if we outlaw gambling as it is now in Illinois, someone's going to fill that market. Some people here think Indiana, Wisconsin, Iowa, and Missouri will take up the slack. Personally, I think organized crime would love to be in control without state regulation or taxes.

Re: Question of the day

Objective Dem — Wed, 22 Apr 2009 18:55:32 -0000

We shouldn't also forget that there are real costs to gambling addiction. Every now and then I hear the story of someone who loses their business, embezzles from their company or commits suicide due to a gambling problem.

Another approach to lowering the costs of gambling identified by the study is to look at ways to mitigate the problems. For instance, I could see putting stronger limits on how much people are allowed to gamble and waiving debts when the limits are ignored. My understanding is casinos are masters at developing ways to trigger the addiction reaction in people. They don't have windows, the games create mesmerizing sense of motion, etc. The state can limit the worst of these.

Re: Question of the day

Kathy Gilroy — Wed, 22 Apr 2009 18:45:28 -0000

It is truly amusing to read comments by people who can't spell or put a sentence together and don't identify themselves, yet consider themselves experts at economics. Those who resort to name-calling reveal that they really have nothing to say. They have obviously never read one of Professor Kindt's studies. His reports in respected, peer-reviewed law journals have more footnotes of proof per page than actual conclusions. There are absolutely NO "unsupported assumptions" nor "leaps of logic", Mr. Wordslinger. Have you also testified before Congress on gambling, as Professor Kindt has?

There are many, many studies that show the costs to the consumer economy of gambling. Go to www.ncalg.org for starters. These studies are not funded by the casino predators, as ARE the studies touting jobs and benefits from gambling.

Who cares if gamblers go to other states? They used to go all the way to Nevada. And, guess which state has one of the highest deficits and rate of foreclosures---Nevada. Gambling hasn't helped Illinois to avoid budget problems.

Gambling has been banned in the U.S. TWICE before. So, it CAN be done. In fact, it was a requirement to ban gambling in a territory in order to become a state. Russia just recently banned gambling, and their economy boomed shortly after. What happened to all the people who want "change"?

People who say "keep the money here" don't understand how the gambling predators work. Most gambling companies are now public companies, which means that they are owned by the stock-holders. Are you insinuating that those stock-holders are all located in Illinois? Most of the COMPANIES are not even located in Illinois. The tax revenues are not the TOTAL revenues.

Yes, Illinois should ban GAMBLING (not "gaming", kids do that). Rev. Tom Grey says that they leave out the "b" and the "l" because they don't want you to know about the "b"ig "l"osers.

Re: Question of the day

Objective Dem — Wed, 22 Apr 2009 18:37:57 -0000

If the issue is the state is losing money due to casinos, the other approach is to increase the money the state gets from casinos. This could be accomplished via taxes, profit sharing, or ownership.

Like alcohol and cigarettes, we should tax at a high enough rate to cover the societal costs. If casinos can stop people from being addicted to gambling and making bets they cannot afford, the taxes would be reduced.

Re: Question of the day

joelrose — Wed, 22 Apr 2009 18:36:18 -0000

A number of comments have made the assertion that if you ban gambling, gamblers will just travel across state lines and gamble in other states, as if there were a fixed amount of gambling the gamblers needed to do. The facts, established by years of research, are that gambling, particularly compulsive gambling, is to a great extent a matter of convenience. Put the temptation in someone's face and they'll succumb to it, but they're not necessarily going to chase it to the next state. For evidence, see the research of John Welte, Research Institute on Addictions, Buffalo, NY, published in the Journal of Gambling Studies.

The gambling industry has used this bogus argument in one state after another, bootstrapping from states that have gambling to neighboring states who fear they're losing revenue. It all makes for a race to the bottom, in which every state loses. Hopefully, one state will be wise enough to call off this madness. Will it be Illinois?

Re: Question of the day

Follow the money — Wed, 22 Apr 2009 17:44:54 -0000

Why are the casinos putting in so many Penny Slots? What kind of people find it entertaining to sit for hours losing money at slot machines? Can't politicans come up with different ideas to fund state government? Or are they getting too much campaign money from gambling?

Re: Question of the day

dan l — Wed, 22 Apr 2009 17:35:04 -0000

@plutocrat:
----
Are these folks â€œwhackosâ€ and â€œgoofs.â€ as well?
----

Not necessarily. But this guy definitely is. Google is your friend.

Re: Question of the day

zatoichi — Wed, 22 Apr 2009 17:16:23 -0000

After reading many of the responses, I keep coming back to how many things you can spend money on where you usually do not come away with something you can touch or carry: movies, plays, sports, concerts, museums, fairs, and endless services that you pay someone else to do. If I pay $125 for Springsteen in Chicago or $5 for the local band in a bar there seems to be very little difference compared to what gambling would cost me in how the same amount of money money is used. How you spend your money is up to you. Like other stuff, live within your means. If you cannot, it does not really matter what you spend the money on, you will get an eventual problem. Talk to anyone with heavy credit card debt.

Re: Question of the day

Third Generation Chicago Nativ — Wed, 22 Apr 2009 16:58:40 -0000

Indiana, (not Indian)

Re: Question of the day

Third Generation Chicago Nativ — Wed, 22 Apr 2009 16:57:49 -0000

Illinois should not ban gambling, look at how much tax revenue Joliet was loosing when the Empress was shut down. $1.5 million a month tax revenue to Joliet And 900 employees.
People would just go to Indian, Iowa or Wisconsin. So why not keep the money here?

Re: Question of the day

Avy Meyers — Wed, 22 Apr 2009 16:54:39 -0000

There is a huge amount of truth to this argument. Casino gambling is counter productive on so many grounds. Funny thing, every one who tells me they go always wins or does no worse than break even. Right! Let's do away with Casino Gambling.

Re: Question of the day

fester — Wed, 22 Apr 2009 16:37:41 -0000

What we should do is stop the sale of automobiles in this state because when people are paying car payments, they aer spending less money on food and other consumer goods. Oh and by the way, they also have less to gamble with.