Yes and Yes; sooner than later. 'Course as a Democrat, know that they will 'tough it out' and get slaughtered in November. We've seen this movie before.
SouthernILRepub
· 3 years ago
1st Question - No; 2nd Question No; Bonus Question - Neither scenario will happen because it they do resign then it looks as if a bigger cover up occured that may have actually occured. If they did resign then it would kill any chances still left of the Republicans keeping a majority in Congress. If both did act in a criminal manner then the FBI or DOJ will deal with them in a sufficient manner.
Carl Nyberg
· 3 years ago
Shimkus should be criminally investigated to see if he was facilitating Foley's criminality when he was brokering introductions.
"C'mon members of the page corps! Meet Congressman Foley. You can call him 'Mark'."
John Farrell
· 3 years ago
Yes, Hastert should resign.
However, to do so requires either
(1) personal integrity or
(2) political acumen.
The first being entirely absent, we'll have to rely on the second.
babs
· 3 years ago
1-No, but heads should roll. If DH doesn't cut some people now, as signal that he's not getting all of the support he needs from his staff-he'll be cutting alot more later. 2-Yes, clearly not the best man for the job. 3-No and they'll all pay for it. This cut and run stuff is not going to help the GOP and it looks like it will get worse before it gets better. 1994 in reverse.
mad parent
· 3 years ago
Yes, both should resign and this coming from a life long Reagan Republican. My son was a page and if our congressional leaders are this blind and this far behind the times, they don't need to be in congress.
Do they not watch Dateline? Foley's scenario is no different than any other abuser of young men.
What on earth did the leadership think Foley was communicating with pages for? He was a closet homosexual and I hesitate to qualify him as that, because homosexuals are not pedophiles.
Red flags were all over the place.
How does anyone know that Foley is in rehab? He would be free to leave at any time. I imagine that he has a passport. He could be long gone by now.
Has his office hard drive been secured and searched? Was he using a blackberry? Do the authorities have it? Do they have his cell phone logs?
This story is only going to get worse because a man like Foley does not make these advances for no reason.
I have been told that the FBI is contacting all pages that served during Foley's terms.
Hastert and Shimkus need to get the heads out of the sand and investigate their own members.
leigh
· 3 years ago
I absolutely believe that Hastert should not resign. Who ever had the IM messages from 2003, however should. Why were they never given to the proper authorities and why were they not released until 6 weeks before the election and sent to ABC news first???? Shimkus I am not sure of. I don't think either of them will resign. In our local papers Hastert has layed out a very believable timeline and explained his actions. While I disagree politically often with the congressman, I believe he does have a lot of personal integrity.
Juice
· 3 years ago
they should both resign their posts. this whole thing is disgusting, and they both knew about it for some time. imagine knowing that your neighbor was regularly molesting young children in his basement every day and you did not inform authorities. wouldn't his neighbors and the entire community scream out for this person's head on a silver platter? What is the difference here? Both Hastert and Shimkus allowed this scumbag to continue his pedophelia without doing anything to protect him.
Has Topinka been asked to comment on this matter? It would be interesting since her spokesperson (McGovern) used to work for Hastert (at least according to the Sept. issue of Chicago Magazine). I wonder if Hastert gave the Topinka juggernaut any campaign cash? If so, will she keep it? Dirty, dirty money.
St. Nick name
· 3 years ago
Shimkus' ego won't let him resign ... how could the old gaurd West Pointer possibly do anything wrong.
The Wrestling coach won't be in the house much longer anyway (he isn't looking too healthy these days)
Anon
· 3 years ago
HASTERT CANT RESIGN! NOR CAN SHIMKUS! This will all blow over. Here's the timeline beginning last Friday:
FRIDAY - Congressman Foley resigns. NOBODY IN CONGRESS has any idea of why?!!! Denny Hastert gets pulled away from the Congressional Buffet Room and has to figure out what is going on! Suddenly, Shimkus is on it! But, his folks say, he didn't see nothin'.
WEEKEND - GOP leaders and K-Street spindoctors work on important discussion points for Fox News. Tony Snow tests new buzzword: "Naughty E-Mails."
MONDAY - Congressman Foley is a drunk; Shimkus, Hastert admit they did see a few e-mails and Shimkus did tell Foley to stay away from the pages (perhaps it was then that Foley gave the RCCC $100,000?)
TUESDAY - New development, Foley is a drunk AND he is gay (REALLY?!) and he was molested by the clergy. Begin national polling (have Foley pay for it from his vast campaign fund).
Wednesday - ?????
Thursday - ?????
Friday - ?????
Weekend - What will the Sunday shows discuss? GOP polling results come back.
Monday - Option 1) bin Laden Captured -or- Option 2) U.S. Invades Iran.
grand old partisan
· 3 years ago
Based on what I have read so far, it seems that most of the blame for any cover-up falls on Shimkus and Hastert’s staff. And to me, their mistake was honestly - but inexcusably - under- appreciating the problem. Were they afraid of the political re-percussions if the story got out? Of course. But, knowing that it would be even worse if the behavior continued and it got out that they could have stopped it earlier, I think there was a tragically naive belief on their part that simply sitting down and letting Foley know they were onto him and that he needs to straighten up (no pun intended) would be enough. I think they failed to understand how sick (in the clinical sense) Foley really was, and that his obvious addiction to dangerous, illicit sexual contact would over-ride whatever reasoning and logic they tried to instill in him. In short: they are more guilty of negligence and ignorance than of malicious or willful endangerment of the pages.
I think Shimkus should resign his role as House page board chair, and let the voters of his district decide if he’s still fit to represent them. I think Hastert is doing the right thing: bringing in the FBI and announcing that he will cooperate fully.
Bluefish
· 3 years ago
Hastert should resign. The responsibility for this mess is directly on his doorstep. If he lacks the integrity to resign, my fellow voters in the 14th district should send him to retirement. I've always voted for Hastert but this is too big a moral failure to overlook.
Leigh - I'm tired of hearing the complaints regarding who sat on the IMs since 2003. The simple fact is that the Republicans in charge knew there was a problem and kept it hidden all this time. They chose power over morals. The political nature of their rouse is evident in the fact they did not share the information with the Dem member of the page oversight committee. So trying to say their release now is dirty politics is beyond the pot calling the kettle black...it's disgusting.
VanillaMan
· 3 years ago
NO! Foley is gone!
Instead of hanging on a-la-Barney Franks or Gary Studds, Foley was shown the door.
Case closed.
Carl Nyberg
· 3 years ago
Look. When people have some information, but fail to investigate they know what's happening. They are counting on pleading ignorance when the problem comes to light.
George Ryan tried to plead ignorance that he was merely negligent about not following-up on indicators of corruption. When the truth came out, what did we learn about Ryan?
Blagojevich is trying the same defense. He was merely not aggressive enough at pursuing the bad apples. Who believes Blagojevich isn't in on the corruption?
And Hastert and Shimkus are trying to claim that they were merely negligent by not digging deeper after learning about the emails.
Here's why I was pretty sure Ryan was guilty. The underlying crimes benefitted Ryan. The money went to his campaign coffers.
The corruption in the Blagojevich administration: who benefits? Rod Blagojevich.
And Hastert's negligence: who benefits? The House Republicans. Either Hastert knew about the IMs or he knew that if he kept digging the story would get worse. So, to protect the House Republicans, Hastert stopped digging.
So, you don't have to prove Hastert saw the IMs to know that he failed to protect the pages from predator Mark Foley. Hastert made a willful decision to stop investigating. He should be held accountable for his decision.
Yellow Dog Democrat
· 3 years ago
Nice wrap-up Carl.
I agree with Sen. Dick Durbin that the page program should be governed by public servants, not politicians, as it is in the Senate.
I think Hastert was in jeopardy anyway, and this only makes matters worse for him. DeLay no longer has his back. He's probably going to lose 10-15 seats in the House. Including two top tier races in his own state. He's strategy of backing Bush to the hilt has been a political disaster, and the GOP has no message now. Finally, if the GOP maintains control over the House, it will be only by a razor-thin margin, and they are going to need a very different kind of leadership and image.
Worst-case scenerio for the Congressional GOP would be holding onto very slim margins in both chambers, staying the course, and losing 20+ seats in the House in '08.
Left Leaner
· 3 years ago
This isn't big enough for Hastert to resign. While he certainly lacks some integrity, this is something for which he was not directly responsible. I'm a big "buck stops here" person and have no love for Hastert, but he has immense responsibility and this is the sort of thing that the Speaker of the House expects his underlings to handle.
That said, Shimkus should resign that post or be removed. He IS the person who should have taken care of this a LONG time ago. This is something that he IS directly responsible for, and he dropped the ball big time.
After that, we should move on. Our soap opera culture loves this stuff, but we have much bigger issues and problems facing our country than a repulsive former Congressman from Florida.
the pug is on the prowl
· 3 years ago
there is no way...anyone who has ever met denny hastert knows hes a straight shooter and doesnt mix in the junk. there is no way 1 sick person ought to be able to bring them down...the whole country will pay if they end up goind down
Davie Dem
· 3 years ago
Hastert "certainly lacks some integrity"?
Either he has integrity or he doesn't. Like being pregnant--it's all or nothing.
Conservative Republican
· 3 years ago
To some degree, I agree with Grand Old Partisan: Shimkus and Hastert (or subordinates) were guilty of "negligence and ignorance". That being said, no harm no foul and the culprit is now out of the picture.
But "negligent and ignorant" of what? Neither Shimkus nor Hastert are human resources professionals or personnel managers. And this is a human resources/ personnel problem. Just because one sliver of their roles includes some "human resources" aspect, their failure to do anything more than instruct Foley to back off the solicitations is not so significant in view of the big picture. Shimkus and Hastert are elected to make laws, shape policy, and, as members of the leadership, lead the Congress and their party in doing the business of the Congress. Their failings, if genuinely any, as "personnel managers" are too insignificant a matter to result in an immediate leadership shake up.
To Democrats, I say bring it on... If you want to scream about Congressional child endangerment, you will lose the attention of the voting public.
(618) Democrat
· 3 years ago
Shimkus should resign because he knew about Foley sending perverted emails to this child and did nothing to protect the welfare of the child. Looks like a cover up to me. Shimkus needs to resign.
Wheres the leadership???
· 3 years ago
The whole page system should be done away with. It is the electronic age. Let them get someone else to fetch their meals and coffee. The arrogance in Congress (and State Legislators) is unreal. We should not subject ANY young person to that.
NW burbs
· 3 years ago
Rich,
The URL for the Sun-Times power rate hike AD is corrupt. You've got an apostrophe in the URL and that's not allowed.
Invalid character in /2006/10/04/rate-hike-may-be-jolt-but-don’t-pull-plug-on-process/ The URL can only contain alphanumerics plus the following characters: /.,=:_-
Downstate Politico
· 3 years ago
No and No. Here's a quick history of other congressional scandals that didn't merit a resignation. In fact, based on this history, it's questionable if Foley should have resigned!
10. Sen. Daniel Inouye. The 82-year-old Hawaii Democrat was accused in the 1990s by numerous women of sexual harassment. Democrats cast doubt on the allegations and the Senate Ethics Committee dropped its investigation.
9. Former Rep. Gus Savage. The Illinois Democrat was accused of fondling a Peace Corps volunteer in 1989 while on a trip to Africa. The House Ethics Committee decided against disciplinary action in 1990.
8. Rep. Barney Frank. The outspoken Massachusetts Democrat hired a male prostitute who ran a prostitution service from Frank’s residence in the 1980s. Only two Democrats in the House of Representatives voted to censure him in 1990.
7. Former Sen. Brock Adams. The late Washington Democrat was forced to stop campaigning after numerous accusations of drugging, assault and rape, the first surfacing in 1988.
6. Former Rep. Fred Richmond. This New York Democrat was arrested in 1978 for soliciting sex from a 16-year-old. He remained in Congress and won re-electionâ€â€before eventually resigning in 1982 after pleading guilty to tax evasion and drug possession.
5. Former Rep. John Young. The late Texas Democrat increased the salary of a staffer after she gave in to his sexual advances. The congressman won re-election in 1976 but lost two years later.
4. Former Rep. Wayne Hays. The late Ohio Democrat hired an unqualified secretary reportedly for sexual acts. Although he resigned from Congress, the Democratic House leadership stalled in removing him from the Administration Committee in 1976.
3. Former Rep. Gerry Studds. He was censured for sexual relationship with underage male page in 1983. Massachusetts voters returned him to office for six more terms.
2. Former Rep. Mel Reynolds. The Illinois Democrat was convicted of 12 counts of sexual assault with a 16-year-old. President Bill Clinton pardoned him before leaving office.
1. Sen. Teddy Kennedy. The liberal Massachusetts senator testified in defense of nephew accused of rape, invoking his family history to win over the jury in 1991.
NW burbs
· 3 years ago
Wheres the leadership??? --
Why do you want to punish the pages for something the Republicans did?
That's like saying we should abolish the Army because Rummy and Cheney planned the Iraq War so poorly. Please.
Republicans are the ones who should be removed for their transgressions -- not the kids who are just there to learn and to serve their country (or in the case of the Army to fight for their country).
Coloradem
· 3 years ago
In the end, it really won't matter. Nancy Pelosi will be the new Speaker in January and in all liklihood Dale Kildee will be heading up the page program. If Hastert resigns, it will be an exercise reminiscent of rearranging the deck chairs on the Titanic....
paddyrollingstone
· 3 years ago
At this point, I don't see how it matters. I really cannot see how the GOP can hold onto the House. They have a 30 seat majority, meaning that the Dems need 15 seats. This is a 6th year election (meaning it is an election in the 6th year of a two term president) and with the notable exception of 1998, the party in power traditionally loses seats in both houses of Congress. While the GOP has more safe seats thanks to gerrymandering, the president is decidedly unpopular and will be a drag on the GOP ticket. Moreover, it appears that a miracle will be needed in Tom DeLay's district as well as Foley's. Tom Reynolds, the head of the NRCC,was in deep trouble before Foleygate and now with revelations that he knew about the e-mails in the spring and that his chief of staff formerly worked for Foley, I can't see how he can pull it out. That is 3 of the 15 right there in traditionally GOP areas. If the polling noted above is correct, than Peter Roskam may go down too. This is not 1994 for the GOP and there are fewer seats at issue, but I truly feel they are in for a beating.
Wumpus
· 3 years ago
How did the Mel Reynolds saga unfold? Jefferson still has his seat
Wheres the leadership???
· 3 years ago
NW Burbs-- What is the job of a Page? I was one in the Statehouse....hated it. Fetched Lunches, laundry etc. Oh, once session was rolling we distributed the bills but now that can all be done now electronically.
I could not believe how the legislators acted during session it was worse that my college frat.
I say if there is no valid purpose for the program GET RID OF IT? If they perform a valid job, then fine, but most of their work can be done electrionically.
If I had my way it I would institute a 2 term limit on all elected officials, it would keep them from thinking they were so privileged, and maybe make them work harder at getting things done rather than playing political games.
True Observer
· 3 years ago
They all went down because there was no Maltese Falcon. If there had been one, there would have been a different ending. The election will decide if the Republicans find the Maltese Falcon (a majority).
Kick 'em in the Shimkus
· 3 years ago
Is Karl Rove Sam Spade in your scenario, Rich?
Yellow Dog Democrat
· 3 years ago
I can't wait for the Tribune editorial board to weigh in on this.
Their front page story today - "Under Fire" - featured a picture of Denny Hastert's head that was - well - as big as his head.
The biggest beneficiaries of this scandal may be Todd Stroger and Rod Blagojevich, as the Tribune is forced to divide it's coverage over the next 30 days to fullfill it's self-proclaimed role as the conscience of the Republican Party.
Citizen Kane
· 3 years ago
Should Hastert step down? NO Should Shimkis step down? NO
The Democrats are doing a great job of tieing two seperate issues into one story. Hastert had full knowledge of the emails that were sent. Did any of you actually read the emails in question? The emails might seem creepy (questions asking the paige what he wanted for his birthday, about his family, etc) but nothing sexual in nature. The emails were simply inappropriate for a business releationship. Hastert and his staff acted, and Shimkis took care of it.
The Instant Messages, however, is where the problems lie. One example is: [i]"Can I have a good kiss goodnight?" Foley was said to have asked in one message. A boy responded with cyber symbols and "kiss."[/i] Foley obviously has issues.
Hastert and Shimkis were not aware of these IMs. The Real person that should be questioned is the staff member who leaked this to the press instead of reporting it to the Speaker's Office or the FBI. You can see that the timing is purely political and meant to damage the GOP's chances in the fall.
jaundiced eye
· 3 years ago
Rich:
It's a shame no one is giving you props for your "Maltese Falcon" dead-on interpretation of the situation. Congratulations!! I think you should start a second question of the day: A pool on the date on which either bin Laden is captured (dead or alive) or Iran is invaded. You know it's "Wag the Dog" time when Ray LaHood is the one making sense ...
Ashur Odishoo
· 3 years ago
What about politicians who have marital infidelity problems? I would be interested to see who was left. Both in DC and Springfield. I have heard a lot of gossip that I bet you have heard also.
It would be interesting if any of these "indiscretions" come to light before the November General Election.
Ashur Odishoo Candidate State Representative 11th District
Carl Nyberg
· 3 years ago
Citizen Kane, if Shimkus and Hastert knew about the emails should they have asked more questions and dug deeper?
Are you sure the emails were all they knew about?
If the pages were openly discussing Foley hitting on them for years, shouldn't Shimkus have been attuned enough to figure it out?
And how do you justify keeping the emails from the other two members of the committee overseeing the page program, Reps. Dale Kildee and Shelly Moore Capito? Doesn't withholding the information suggest Shimkus knew what Foley was doing and had made a conscious decision to protect him?
Rich Miller
· 3 years ago
NW burbs, it works for me. I tried it twice. Thanks, though.
Carl Nyberg
· 3 years ago
Rich, I'm using IE 6.0 and I'm having same prob as NW burbs.
Carl Nyberg
· 3 years ago
Downstate Politico, are you satisfied Shimkus and Hastert did the right thing?
Southern Ilinois Democrat
· 3 years ago
Hastert should step down and Shimkus should resign. Of course, if they choose to continue to claim they did nothing wrong, feign ignorance, and blame everybody that comes to mind then hopefully the voters are smart enough to help with their early retirements. I know I plan on helping Shimkus be able to spend more time in Collinsville by voting for Stover.
Citizen Kane
· 3 years ago
Carl, are you saying that you don't see any coincidence in the timing of this story? Gee, the elections are a few weeks away...
In my opinion, if you asked either Hastert or Shimkis what an IM was, they wouldn't have a clue. Outside the people who post on this blog, its pretty safe to say that no one over 30 would know what an IM is.
Shimkis was given the information regarding the email correspondence, and he dealt with it. Why should the information be passed on to more people? According to the AP, the parents of the page asked that the emails be ended, and that nothing more was to be made of it in order to protect her son. Shimkis followed their wishes.
If you want to spin conspiracy theories, lets play this one out... Had the IMs been brought to their attention back in 2003, don't you think that they would have dealt with the situation right after the 2004 elections? If they were aware, I would guess that Hastert and Shimkis would have pushed Foley to retire in early 2005, so that they would have plenty of time to choose a replacement and position him/her to hold that seat.
Carl Nyberg
· 3 years ago
CK, the page's family has been trying to raise the issue about Foley for a long time now. Hastert and Shimkus had the information and was trying to kill it.
The story broke before an election. Having been around the block a couple times I know that people are more likely to leak damaging information before an election. So what? Just because Blago's $1,5000 check and property tax assessment came out during an election doesn't mean that Blago's conduct shouldn't be criticized. Right?
The IMs aren't the issue. The issue is that Mark Foley was trying to have sex with pages and Shimkus and Hastert had indicators this was the case but chose to remain ignorant. Or in Shimkus' case, he probably knew and was facilitating Foley meeting more pages.
NW burbs
· 3 years ago
Rich, Maybe it's Firefox... so be it.
--
Wheres the leadership?? --
You wrote, If I had my way it I would institute a 2 term limit on all elected officials
Every state that has instituted something like that (where all legislators and statewide officers are term limited) has found that the lobbyists end up taking over because they are the only ones with any institutional memory.
Like it or not, I'd rather have elected officials at least nominally in charge and nominally answerable to voters as opposed to allowing lobbyists even more power than they already have.
--
Citizen Kane -- Shimkus is both a father and formerly a teacher, as is Hastert. It wasn't just "overly friendly" emails (one red flag right there). It was also dinners and drinks with 16-year-olds (another red flag). It was also warnings from GOP staffers to pages as early as 2001 (see any more red flags? I do).
Want another HUGE. RED. FLAG. Citizen Kane? How about the remarks Congressman Foley made after Congressman Shimkus introduced him at the 2001-2002 outgoing page ceremony:
Mr. SHIMKUS. I thank my colleague. Now someone who spends a lot of time with you also, the gentleman from Florida (Mr. Foley), would like to say a thank you. Mr. FOLEY. I warn all of you not to cry in front of me, please, so I can get through this very important day with you without shedding tears as well. […]
…and finally John Eunice. John was the highest bidder on lunch with Mark Foley. Maybe you all do not know this story, but John had paid considerable sums to dine with me. I had offered to take the winning bidder to lunch in the Members’ dining room. Then I heard how much John Eunice paid. And I said, “John, there is no way in the world after you committed so much money to have lunch with me that I would dare take you downstairs to eat in the Members’ dining room.'’ I said, “Where do you want to go?'’ He says, without reservation, “Morton’s.'’ I said, “Morton’s? Like in Morton’s Steakhouse?'’ He said, “Oh, would that be too much?'’ I said, “Oh, no, we’ll go.'’ I said, “Call your mother, get permission, make sure she notifies the Clerk and we will go to Morton’s.'’ And so we proceeded to cruise down in my BMW to Morton’s. And all of this story is meant to make you all feel jealous that you were not the high bidders. So we went to Morton’s, and I do not know where you all went.
What's it going to take for you to drop the partisan blinders and stop defending the indefensible? Foley was preying on 16-year-olds and our Republican leadership did nothing (except, as Bob Novak informs, apparently cajole Foley into running for reelection just to retain a GOP seat).
Pathetic. Pathetic. Pathetic.
True Observer
· 3 years ago
Timeline-
2003 Instant Messages. (in possession of someone)
2006 E-Mails come to attention of Hastert, Shimkus, various media and FBI.
Shimkus tells Foley to knock it off.
Media and FBI take no action because innocuous.
Nothing further from Foley to Pages.
5 weeks before election the mysterious holder of the 2003 instant messages distributes them to the media.
Carl Nyberg
· 3 years ago
Mark Foley tried to bugger pages on the Hill. Shimkus has indications this was happening and continued to introduce Foley to new pages.
And Republicans claim the problem is the motives of the people who released the IMs?
What would have been so hard for Hastert and Shimkus to do the right thing? Either could have asked for a more complete investigation into Foley's conduct. They didn't. Why not? They put the good of the House Republicans ahead of the pages, right?
Pat Hickey
· 3 years ago
Casting Shift a bit
Spade - Rich Miller Joel Cairo - Foley O'Shaughnessey- Reynolds
Spade to Cairo
'When you get slapped, take it - and like it.'
Later,
Gutman to Spade
'By Gad, Sir, You are a Character. 'Pon my Word.'
Mr. Joe Cairo & friends
· 3 years ago
They are going to throw Shimkus under the bus in order to save Hastert. How far under the bus is now the question; just giving the control of the page program over to another member, or something more drastic remains to be seen.
I think the smartest play would be a bipartisan emergency committee to take over the program and reformat the leadership so both parties have control and cover at the same time. One Dem and one Rep in charge. Bringing in a third overseer from the pool of ex-pages would be a good move as long as their public record is clean. The Third Man (what's with the old movie references today?) would break any ties when the leaders have to make a decision.
Six Degrees of Separation
· 3 years ago
Denny will not resign his speakership before the election. He will be handily re-elected in the 14th but will lose his speakership to the new razor thin Dem majority in the House. He will serve out the remaining 2 years of his term as Congressman Hastert, a title more befitting him than Accidental Speaker. He will call in all the favors he can to get $$$ into his district before he retires in 08.
Shimkus will be re-elected, serve 1 more term and then retire in 08, way past his "term limit".
Carl Nyberg
· 3 years ago
There are two issues. The governance of the page program and perhaps its existence are suspect.
But the other issue is that Shimkus, Hastert and other Republican leaders covered-up Foley's activity, the same way George Ryan stalled and covered-up in the license for bribes scandal and the way Blagojevich is stalling and covering-up now.
Is it wrong when Republicans cover-up a Republican Congressman sexually pursuing pages?
Lovie's Leather
· 3 years ago
Man, Rich, you are going all out with this national stuff. Very out of character... but I don't care about Hastert or Shimkus one way or the other... How about Ron Paul for Speaker...? Or how about Ray Lahood???
Anon
· 3 years ago
"True Observer" is close to the bone.
Gentlemen, this is an "October Surprise."
Mr. Foley's actions are reprehendible. That goes almost without saying. But they were not secret. There are multiple indications that hundreds of beltway insiders, including pages and their parents and staffers and members of congress -- of both parties -- knew that Foley was light in his loafers and much too much interested in other people's kids.
Look at the time-line in this a.m.'s NYT. The media "discovery" of this seems to have been with some "watch dog" group and then ABC. Where did they get the info? Who decided that a few weeks before a very close congressional election, an infered child molestation scandle was just what was needed?
Answer: the persons who would benefit. But they are only the oportunistic messengers, not the persons responsible for this scandle.
Who's responsible? Like the Bishops who swept clerical abuse under the carpet, the bishops of the house are responsible for this national black-eye. They should resign.
Bodie Zoffa
· 3 years ago
Morris, Clinton's old aid, reports that a prominent Congressman in the Democratic leadership knew about Foley months ago. This is going to backfire on the Dems.
Hypocritical Democrat
· 3 years ago
They should both be forced to resign their posts and even their seats.
I know we Democrats have a long history, covering the last 4 decades, of ignoring our own members who have done this very same thing. Heck we even went so far as to throw our full support behind our child molesting members even after they were convicted.
But we're not talking about us we're talking about a Republican now so there should be a different standard. We feel the Republicans should be held to a higher standard in regards to political conduct than we ourselves are held to. As Democrats we're not responsible for our actions it's always someone else's fault.
Lovie's Leather
· 3 years ago
The democrats hypocricy is well noted... but, should they (whether they were a D or R) be forced to resign their positions??? The whole political game is pointing out each other's hypocricy.... It seems a little hypocritical. If I were Hastert, I wouldn't resign. I don't think anyone in his position would. I don't know how much he knew about the incident. But I think he is taking the right steps now.
Snidely Whiplash
· 3 years ago
I'm not a big fan of Hastert, but just how in the hell is this supposed to be HIS fault??? He's an easy target for the Dems now, and I think that the R's who are blasting him are doing so for the purpose of protecting their party at the Speaker's expense. Always has to be a sacraficial lamb.
(618) Democrat
· 3 years ago
Congressman Tom Reynolds'cheif of staff just resigned over the sex predator scandal.
Stay tuned lots more to come.
I was watching Fox news earlier and gentleman from the Reagan administration says that anyone who had anything to do with this scandal should resign. That would be you Shimkus.
steve schnorf
· 3 years ago
"No" and "No". Without far more information that is damning, these are only partisan cries for partisan reasons.
Lovie's Leather Loves Perverts
· 3 years ago
I was wondering when the GOP talking points would make their way here.
Blame the media. Blame the kids. Blame the Democrats.
But the GOP ?
Hey, lets not play the blame game, okay ?
SouthernILRepub
· 3 years ago
Rich, Your thoughts on the afternoon radio post?
Bill Baar's Physician
· 3 years ago
Talk about an "October Surprise" is just Fox News spin that intentionally ignores the facts.
There might have been an "October Surprise" - but it would have been October 2005, an off-year.
If Shimkus, the Chair of the Page Board, had done his job, then he should have had this scandal out in the open a year ago, and it would have been addressed and behind the GOP.
Shimkus, this "surprise" could've been sprung in any month you preferred. It was in your hands.
And the Speaker's hands.
And Reynolds' hands.
Any of you could have picked the timing. But you sat on it because you were afraid to deal with it.
This is your own doing.
Hastert and Shimkus should resign. Now.
Yellow Dog Democrat
· 3 years ago
Downstate Politico --
Nice spin. As I mentioned when this story first broke, Republicans will try very hard to "bipartisanize" this issue, just as they did with the Abramoff scandal. It won't work. Not to mention how desparate Republicans look going back 30 YEARS to find parallels to Foley in the Democratic Party, or that not one of these cases parallels the Hastert-Shimkus cover-up.
Hastert and Shimkus' handling of all of this reminds me a Sgt. Schultz of Hogan's Heroes: "I see nothing. NOTHING!" If they had exercised due diligence, we would've found out about these instant messages ten months ago. Now, they want to blame the media for not doing their job for them. Ironic, and that won't work either.
(618) Democrat
· 3 years ago
Steve Schnorf, if these are partisan cries for partisan reasons how come there are Republicans asking for their resignation. Lots of people, Republican and Democrat, in Illinois and all over the U.S. think they should resign because they, Hastert and Shikus, tried to cover up for their colleague Foley the pervert.
Bubs
· 3 years ago
I do believe that a deep breath is needed.
I recall the initial Washington media frenzy over the Valerie Plame story, but now even the Washington Post has turned strongly against Joe Wilson. Let's see what is real, and what is frenzy. It's Washington, after all.
I'm certainly not convinced someone shouldn't resign from something, but it should only occur if real misconduct, not hype and innuendo, is shown. This is obviously an election season play, but there is substance to it, given Foley's conduct, and all the facts have to be stated.
For example, I note that the accusation against Hastert and Shimkus is of not taking appropriate action, which is a far cry from the criminal investigations we have to deal with in Illinois. Even Foley is not accused of actual physical molestation (yet?), although the racy e-mails to a 16 year old are truly bad enough.
I note that the family of the Page who received the 2005 e-mail affiratively asked that the response be limited to telling Foley not to contact the Page, and Shimkus did just that. Whether Shimkus should have respected the family's wishes, as he did, or told them that this was too serious and had to go to investigation, is a very fair question, and will turn on what he actually knew of Foley's actual conduct.
As far as Hastert, I have yet to see how he actually knew anything, but this is only developing, and we shall see.
Buck Flagojevich
· 3 years ago
Should a president resign if he is caught boinking a page, male or female? Hummm.
Schnorf nails it right on the head. I am in agreement with the assessment.
Carl Nyberg
· 3 years ago
steve schnorf, do you think Hastert and Shimkus are telling the complete truth? If so, why is Shimkus ducking the media? Why do members of Congress keep flip-flopping on whether they told Hastert?
Boone Logan Square
· 3 years ago
Based on the way Boehner, Reynolds, and Hastert keep stabbing each other in the back on this story, the leadership is in disarray. If Hastert resigns, it's a death blow to Republican hopes of keeping the majority and if he doesn't, he becomes a growing liability in over five dozen districts.
Mick Jones may be the best pundit on the topic of Hastert's future: "If I stay there will be trouble. And if I go it may be double."
Middle Majority
· 3 years ago
Is it just me or do old Carl's vociferous, slanderous, and over-the-top accusations smack of gay-bashing? Should we suspect every gay man who expresses interest in young people of being a closet pedophile? Is that only reasonable caution by responsible officials? Seems judgemental and problematic to me.
HANKSTER
· 3 years ago
Kirk Fordham, a former aide to ex-Rep. Mark Foley, said he alerted the office of the Republican leader of the House of Representatives two years ago about worrisome conduct by Foley with teenage pages, AP reports.
anon
· 3 years ago
Hastert RESIGN! Shimkus RESIGN!
These men do not deserve to serve the people of the United States of America and especially the great state of Illinois. What I find interesting is that Hastert asks for the advice of the Catholic Archdiocese. Where else would one go to get the BEST cover up advice available?
anon
· 3 years ago
Another thing, the R's are claiming he was drunk when he sent these emails. In the emails Floey, I mean Foley, writes that he has to go vote.
Does this mean he was drunk when voting on legislation? Does this change a rollcall on any votes?
Carl Nyberg
· 3 years ago
Accusing me of "gay-bashing"?
Notice how the GOP response to issue of the Republican leadership covering-up Foley's predatory behavior is to try to change the subject to anything else.
Did Shimkus have enough information to fill-in-the-blanks on Foley? Kinda hard to tell since he's ducking media outlets that will ask him this kind of question.
When someone acts guilty and there is circumstantial evidence that they have misbehaved, is it an unreasonable inference that something bad happened?
anon
· 3 years ago
Hastert has changed his story again and again and again, trying to claim the House leadership “didn’t know.â€Â
That’s a flat lie.
There have now been at least two high-level GOP figures, Boehner and Reynolds, who gave direct quotes to the press saying Hastert personally knew about the Foley “problemâ€Â. Hastert has pointedly refused to dispute Reynold’s assertion.
The undisputed facts here are these: the GOP pages (but not the Democratic pages) were “warned†about Foley as of 2001. GOP Members Alexander, Shimkus, Reynolds, Boehner, and Hastert, at minimum, knew about the problem. It came up very directly again in late 2005, and there are stories in the press describing Hastert and the others as discussing the problem multiple times between then and the spring of 2006.
And nothing happened.
Hastert himself knew, his office knew, and a sizable chunk of the leadership knew  and they just didn’t do nothing, they PREVENTED the usual channels from even investigating the claims.
Carl Nyberg
· 3 years ago
AP is reporting Hastert's staff was informed about Foley in 2004. So, who was playing politics with the allegations in 2004?
Are you sure you want to stick out your neck for Hastert?
Carl, I don't know. Neither do you. Neither does anyone else commenting here. That's why I said we are only hearing the cries of those willing to damn someone without information. If more substantiated information comes out that Shimkus or Hastert knew months or years prior to today that Foley was sending sexual e-mails to a 16 year old, regardless of whether it was a young man or a young woman, then I'll be paying far more attention.
I didn't believe Clinton should resign over Monica, and I thought we were silly to impeach him. To me, it didn't rise to the level of something a President should lose his job over and we were acting as partisans out of our dislike for Clinton and Hillary. I wonder if that's what's happening here.
So, even if more damning evidence comes out, I'm not sure that anyone should resign, but I'm pretty sure no one should yet.
Anon
· 3 years ago
Buck Flagojevich at @ 2:51 pm wrote:
"Should a president resign if he is caught boinking a page, male or female? Hummm."
If you're trying to be clever and refer to Bill Clinton and Monica Lewinsky, then let me remind you Lewinsky was 22-years old when she had sex with Clinton.
GOP Rep. Foley has admitted to preying on 16-year olds.
Or as you might call it - "boinking."
What's most disturbing, though, is your suggestion that GOP Rep. Foley shouldn't have resigned.
Nauseating.
Bluefish
· 3 years ago
GOP House leadership and senior staff are providing the media with information that contradicts what Hastert is saying. Sounds to me like the effort to force Denny out has begun.
Carl Nyberg
· 3 years ago
When Republican members of Congress keep changing their stories about what they told Hastert and when, what is the reasonable inference?
Why did Shimkus keep the emails from Reps. Kildee and Capito?
Scott Fawell's Cellmate
· 3 years ago
In our discussion about Rep. Mark Foley's (R-Fla.) the sexually graphic online emails to children and the GOP leadership’s ongoing cover-up of Foley’s sexual predatory practices, lets not lose focus and forget the victims. I know I'm repeating what I sand others have already written, but its important to remember we're dealing with particularly vulnerable victims: House pages. 16-year old kids living in dorms, away from home (most likely for the first time), looking for adult mentors and leaders in public service.
Accordingly, Members and their staffs owe a special duty to these children and to their parents, as shown from the below excerpt from an online article from ABC News.
“The bright high school juniors who come to Washington to be pages are wards of Congress, much like orphans were when the House first hired them to run errands in centuries past.
In their gray and navy uniforms, they get a taste of power while doing humdrum jobs, serving at the whim of an institution that shelters, educates and pays them while they are far from home.
The potential for abuse is apparent, as it always is when power and powerlessness are in the same room….
Members of Congress are expected to take special responsibility for the welfare of pages and act in place of their parents. Protections introduced since the early 1980s include an increase in the starting age of pages to 16 from 14, dorms for them to live in, heightened supervision and a board to protect their well-being.†(http://www.abcnews.go.com/Politics/print?id=252...)
****
House Pages have done nothing wrong, and yet Hastert and the GOP leadership who failed the Pages now want to destroy the House Page program. The House Pages were the innocent victims here, and now Hastert and the GOP want to punish them - again.
****
I have a proposal for Speaker Hastert, Shimkus, Boehner, Reynolds and the rest of the GOP leadership who failed - intentionally or unintentionally - to protect children: demand that Foley donate his $2.7M campaign warchest to the House Page program to create real safeguards for these young people.
Little Egypt
· 3 years ago
Come on people - these are 16 year olds we are talking about. These are not young adults who have reached the age of majority. Their families have allowed them to go to D.C. believing there was good supervision for their children. This should not be about politics. It should be about a perverted queer who can't control his thoughts and feelings and God knows what else. Oh, yeah, Foley has admitted he's gay! WHO KNEW? So let's see, Foley is a gay alcoholic who never drank on the job but that is contradicted by the time dates on some of the IM's. Oh and he's been molested as a youth by a priest. OKAY, so what's his point. Go into rehab and hope all is forgiven?
Haster is toast as far as House Speaker goes. He probably won't resign but after the election when new leadership is chosen, he will be sitting on the sidelines.
Shimkus, you are a total embarassment to yourself, your family, your constituents, and please stop waving the West Point banner. I am VERY familiar with West Point and you sir are no Norman Schwartzkopf. The very least Shimkus should do is resign his position as head of the pages. The very most he should do is be forced to send his children to D.C. to be pages.
This has possibly been a criminal cover-up. It's bad enough that our politicians are slimy, sleazy, cheaters, liars, and crooks. Do we as voters not have a limit as to the corruption we will tolerate?
As for Hastert, he's toast. After the election, he will not remain as Speaker of the House. Shimkus should resign at least his post as head of the pages.
Bill Baar's Physician
· 3 years ago
Congratulations, Steve Schnopf, you and the rest of the GOP win today's award for Hypocrites of the Day.
After wasting $70M+ and years of Congress’ legislative time and resources on Monicagate, Whitewater, Travelgate, and every other failed GOP “investigation†and “hearing†in the 1990s, the GOP now sides with alleged sexual predator Mark Foley and the GOP leadership who protected him and says after 6 days we should really ease off and let cooler heads prevail.
Wow.
It would be a laughable suggestion, coming from this GOP Congress and their media lapdogs, if this wasn't the most important topic conceiveable: protecting children from sexual predators.
The victims here are 16-year old House pages, not Denny Hastert and John Shimkus.
Bluefish
· 3 years ago
BB's Dr. - "Hypocrites of the Day"? Don't sell them short. They're the clear cut leaders for the 2006 award.
Perhaps this incident is one of the reasons Shimkus is avoiding the media.
The people sticking by Shimkus and Hastert are being as partisan as Shimkus and Hastert were when they stood by Foley.
Shimkus has explaining to do.
1. What did he know? And when? 2. What did he do or neglect to do to protect Foley? 3. To what extent did he facilitate Foley meeting pages he wouldn't have met otherwise? And did Shimkus provide this "service" to any other members of Congress or Washington, DC powerbrokers?
DOWNSTATE
· 3 years ago
Say want you want but our Governor adores Mark Foley for taking the heat for 2 days.
Left Leaner
· 3 years ago
Stop the "October Surprise" and blaming the "liberal media" stuff. If this had been taken care of when it was discovered = blow over before election. Media jumps on a juicy story = that's what they do because it sells.
Carl Nyberg
· 3 years ago
From the Left claims an unconfirmed source has emailed him that Hastert will resign as Speaker on Friday.
Madison County Watcher
· 3 years ago
If Hastert and/or his staff knew - and Shimkus did not know - anything but the excerpts of that first e-mail, will any of the people commenting here apologize to Shimkus?
(I'm sure the answer will be no, but I'll return to this post when the answer to the above question is known)
BonVoyage John
· 3 years ago
Wow are we in Illinois luck A stinking drunk Foley was turned away from the page dorm.
Perhaps this incident is one of the reasons Shimkus is avoiding the media.
The people sticking by Shimkus and Hastert are being as partisan as Shimkus and Hastert were when they stood by Foley.
Bet this happened when Terry "Tommy Gun: Gainer headed the Capitol Police. Let's get him on the horn and ask for the reports. Or did he and Shimkus run over to the campaign committee for another meeting?
Bubs
· 3 years ago
Nyberg, this is what I'm talking about. I read your link. The newspaper calls it no more than a "report," and second or third hand at best. You treated it as a fact. Could very well be true, but let's wait and see.
I do think there is real trouble here for somebody other than Foley, but I'm not sure who it is. I'm not even sure this rises to criminal conduct by anyone, even Foley, though I strongly suspect the e-mails must have violated something more than common decency. It will play out fast, that's for sure! So let's get to the facts - it should only take a few days.
leigh
· 3 years ago
Hastert is not resigning. I just received an e-mail from his office warning of the psychotic group that is making automated calls in his district and lying through their teeth about any and everything they can. If these liberal democrats keep up with this it could very well backfire. There needs to be a serious investigation. The wrongdoers should be punished.
Carl Nyberg
· 3 years ago
Does the Foley cover-up mean that all of the following seats are "in play": IL-06 (Hyde retirement), IL-08 (Bean), IL-10 (Kirk), IL-11 (Weller), IL-14 (Hastert), IL-17 (Evans vacancy) and IL-19 (Shimkus)?
Buck Flagojevich
· 3 years ago
Anon - Wednesday, Oct 4, 06 @ 3:51 pm:
I never suggested that Foley shouldn’t have resigned. That sicko should be prosecuted to the full extent of the law and sent to do some time with people who can take care of perv's like him.
Whether 16 or 22 it's an abuse of power. If the young Pages were afraid to come forward to their superiors, where were their parents? If my kid told me this, I sure wouldn't stand idly by. I would be talking to my attorney and the press.
Scott Fawell's Cellmate
· 3 years ago
Disturbing article and allegations, Carl Nyberg at 4:37, for a number of reasons.
First, its immoral and repugnant that Foley thought of the House page dorm as a one-stop shop for sexual predators.
Second, its disturbing that the GOP leadership STILL DOES NOT GET IT !
According to the article, Rep. Deborah Pryce, R-Ohio, "'contacted the clerk and asked her to look into this rumor,' said Geoff Embler, a spokesman for Pryce. Rep. Roger Wicker, a Mississippi Republican, asked Pryce and other House leaders, including House Speaker Dennis Hastert, about the alleged incident during a conference call Monday evening, Embler said."
GOP Rep. Pryce reported the alleged preying on minors to the House Clerk, a direct employee of the GOP Speaker - why didn't Pryce contact the House Ethics Committee or the House Page Board ?
GOP Rep. Wicker raised the incident during a conference call with House GOP Members - why didn't Wicker refer the incident to the House Ethics Committee, the House Page Board and/or the Capitol Police ?
The House Republican leadership continues to treat Foley's crimes against children and the leadership's cover-up of these crimes as a political matter to be strategized.
This is not an earmark for a road, an amendment to a trade agreement, or some other bill that the Speaker and the Republican leadership can bypass establsihed committees, procedures and the minority party to deal with.
Parents know this is different, and the House GOP had better damn well know this.
Little Egypt
· 3 years ago
Madison County Watcher - NO apologies to Shimkus. If he had stood by his pledge to limit his terms in Congress, this would not be an issue for him, PERIOD.
Left Leaner
· 3 years ago
Illinois is cracking me up!
Former Governor gets six years for this and that.
Current Goveror is under investigation by the feds.
Hastert and Shimkus both involved in "Foley Scandal."
Cong. Davis visiting "terrorists" in Sri Lanka.
Jack Ryan had to drop out of Senate race for possible nefarious behavior - to be replaced by.....Alan Keyes (?)
Cook County broke and under federal investigation.
And then there's always Mayor Daley and the Chicago machine.
I love it! People around the country must be getting a kick out of this State!
Captain America
· 3 years ago
Haven't had time to follow details of this story - neutral on Hastert/Shimkus resignation.
This story has doomed the Republican effort to hang on to control of the House of Representatives - regardless of how the Republican leadership questiion is resolved.
The longer this story gos on the worse it becomes for Republicans.
Hastert won't be speaker anymore come January.
Bubs
· 3 years ago
Re: Update #2.
If this guy Fordham is correctly quoted by the AP, then it's exactly what I was talking about.
Let's see what is real, after the Beltway hysteria has run its course.
Buck Flagojevich
· 3 years ago
Left Leaner,
And our Governor is probably still floating his name around Washington for a possible shot at the big time. I'm sure he is convinced he still has a chance at running for Prez.
Scott Fawell's Cellmate
· 3 years ago
To Madison COunty Watcher at 4:57:
"If Hastert and/or his staff knew - and Shimkus did not know - anything but the excerpts of that first e-mail, will any of the people commenting here apologize to Shimkus?"
You and the rest of the GOP lemmings STILL don't get it.
The "first email" was enough to put Shimkus on notice. As Hastert stated, the "first email" was a red flag of a situation needing swift and comprehensive action.
So the "first email" was enough for Shimkus to require to do what he was supposed to do, i.e. live up to his duty to protect the children of the country.
Shimkus likes to puff out his chest and say he's a West Point alum, but he failed to live up to the West Point creed: Duty, Honor, Country.
Madison County Watcher
· 3 years ago
To Little Egypt: It would be an issue, because Shimkus would still be running in 06. His term limit pledge would have set his retirement at the end of his term in 2008. Shows you really don't know much about the issue. (6 terms = 12 years, 1996 + 12 years = 2008)
To Scott Fawell's Cellmate: Only you and your Democrat lemmings continue to press the issue that Shimkus knew more than he actually did (according to the evidence in published reports). Is there any evidence to suggest that Shimkus had knowledge beyond the first e-mail? Listen to the Brennan interview at KMOX.com. Shimkus handled the issue by following some of the wishes of the page's parents. Are you faulting that? Shimkus has apologized for taking the word of an elected colleague (Foley) and, yes, it has burnt him. But is there evidence that Shimkus is involved in covering anything up? Not yet and there probably won't be. The only evidence is just the partisan hype and speculation from the hacks that read on this blog.
NoGiftsPlease
· 3 years ago
The other burning question is how a gay man found such a powerful spot in the republican party? That shocks me almost as much a the allegations themselves!
Grocery Guy
· 3 years ago
In 2006, Mark Foley will be to the Republican Party what Steve Bartman was to the Cubs in 2004.
RealClear
· 3 years ago
Hastert should resign as Speaker immediately, and also announce his total retirement from the House, to be effective in the near future. I suppose we have to give him a little time to get any remaining real estate deals in order.
Shimkus should not only step down as head of that Page program, he should announce he's going to keep his term limit promise afterall.
These two guys exemplify better than most how the Republicans have betrayed the hopes and aspirations of the 1994 Revolution. They've gotten fat and arrogant faster than the Dems did in power.
Speaker Pelosi is scary to say, but these clowns we've left out there too long have squandered our trust and brought this on the country and the Party. After 2 yrs of the Dems in control, we'll take another shot at getting some better Republicans in there.
More shoes are going to drop on this scandal. Hastert and Shimkus need to do the right thing NOW.
Roy Slade
· 3 years ago
I agree with Downstate- the Blagonuts are thrilled that the "story" has changed- and their names are out of the current headlines. I believe that most of what has been written today and yesterday is just propaganda- however, when the Feds are done investigating, then let the chips fall where they may. (That is the differnce between the GOP and the Dems. IF they are at fault- throw the book at them. When a US Senator wrecks his vehicle on a Bridge- leaving a defenseless woman inside- the Dems want to offer counsleling.
Enough of the postering- let the FBI do their job.
Anonymous
· 3 years ago
Yes, and let's make sure Hastert stays as Speaker so he can better coordinate the responses to all FBI inquiries.
Let's not get TOO serious about this wanting to get all the facts first thing.
Anon
· 3 years ago
NO! Speaker Hastert did what he should have done. Calling for his resignation is a simple Deomcratic ploy to distract voters from the real issues.
Troy News Guy
· 3 years ago
Didn't we learn anything from the catholic priest scandal? The INSTANT Shimkus heard about this issue, he should have CYA'd and called the police. I listened live to his KMOX appearance this morning, and while I was on the fence before after that I truly believed he will be gone. He had no comeback for what Rich calls "sympathetic" interview. He's a fall guy.
Little Egypt
· 3 years ago
Madison County Watcher, you really cut me down to size. Thanks, I needed that. Now go work on your boy John Shimkus for not having sense enough to know that Foley was having inappropriate contact with pages. Or do you just like to cut down people who don't agree with you? Duty, Honor, Country. Shimkus lacks all three of these. He and Hastert made this political from the get-go. Now it's coming back to bite him and bite him hard. Nope, no apologies from me. I don't care what group is coming out with this in time for the elections. It could have all been avoided if the two politicans had handled this in the legal way it should have been. But it was all to protect their political majority in the U.S. House, which I think we can all pretty much agree will go bye bye real soon.
Madison County Watcher
· 3 years ago
Little Egypt: Your suggestion that Shimkus is involved in something that was "illegal" (you question if he did it the "legal" way) is insulting, and again, a statement that is completely from thin air.
It's also obvious that you are unable to separate the facts of this ongoing scandal to make separate determinations between what Hastert, Hastert's staff, Shimkus, and what any other people might have known.
Whether we agree or disagree has no bearing on pointing out the errors in your analysis.
The attacks on Shimkus' "duty, honor, country" is same smack that the Downstate Democrats For Change (and other former Tim Bagwell volunteers) have been pushing for over a year now. It's insulting and shows the partisanship that most voters in the 19th District flat out don't tolerate.
If Shimkus' future is to be determined by his "duty and honor", I like his chances.
Per the State Journal this morning: "With all this on Shimkus’ plate, he still showed up Tuesday to meet with our editorial board. We appreciate that, but we weren’t surprised. Few who have met Shimkus would question his decency. Even those who disagree with his conservative Republican politics still tend to like him and describe him as a “good guy.†Yet even good guys make mistakes."
Shimkus is accountable and doesn't back down from a fight. He made a mistake, but this talk by his opponents of this being more than a mistake is hurting any chance Stover might have had.
The evidence clearly shows that Shimkus knew of one e-mail, nothing more. Your suggestions that any smoking gun sits in the 19th District are false, unfounded, wrong, lacking evidence, and full of partisanship.
But, please, keep up the partisanship. Southern Illinois voters will love the changes Nancy Pelosi and Danny Stover will be bringing to the country.
All Comments
"C'mon members of the page corps! Meet Congressman Foley. You can call him 'Mark'."
However, to do so requires either
(1) personal integrity or
(2) political acumen.
The first being entirely absent, we'll have to rely on the second.
Do they not watch Dateline? Foley's scenario is no different than any other abuser of young men.
What on earth did the leadership think Foley was communicating with pages for? He was a closet homosexual and I hesitate to qualify him as that, because homosexuals are not pedophiles.
Red flags were all over the place.
How does anyone know that Foley is in rehab? He would be free to leave at any time. I imagine that he has a passport. He could be long gone by now.
Has his office hard drive been secured and searched? Was he using a blackberry? Do the authorities have it? Do they have his cell phone logs?
This story is only going to get worse because a man like Foley does not make these advances for no reason.
I have been told that the FBI is contacting all pages that served during Foley's terms.
Hastert and Shimkus need to get the heads out of the sand and investigate their own members.
Has Topinka been asked to comment on this matter? It would be interesting since her spokesperson (McGovern) used to work for Hastert (at least according to the Sept. issue of Chicago Magazine). I wonder if Hastert gave the Topinka juggernaut any campaign cash? If so, will she keep it? Dirty, dirty money.
The Wrestling coach won't be in the house much longer anyway (he isn't looking too healthy these days)
FRIDAY - Congressman Foley resigns. NOBODY IN CONGRESS has any idea of why?!!! Denny Hastert gets pulled away from the Congressional Buffet Room and has to figure out what is going on! Suddenly, Shimkus is on it! But, his folks say, he didn't see nothin'.
WEEKEND - GOP leaders and K-Street spindoctors work on important discussion points for Fox News. Tony Snow tests new buzzword: "Naughty E-Mails."
MONDAY - Congressman Foley is a drunk; Shimkus, Hastert admit they did see a few e-mails and Shimkus did tell Foley to stay away from the pages (perhaps it was then that Foley gave the RCCC $100,000?)
TUESDAY - New development, Foley is a drunk AND he is gay (REALLY?!) and he was molested by the clergy. Begin national polling (have Foley pay for it from his vast campaign fund).
Wednesday - ?????
Thursday - ?????
Friday - ?????
Weekend - What will the Sunday shows discuss? GOP polling results come back.
Monday - Option 1) bin Laden Captured -or- Option 2) U.S. Invades Iran.
I think Shimkus should resign his role as House page board chair, and let the voters of his district decide if he’s still fit to represent them. I think Hastert is doing the right thing: bringing in the FBI and announcing that he will cooperate fully.
Leigh - I'm tired of hearing the complaints regarding who sat on the IMs since 2003. The simple fact is that the Republicans in charge knew there was a problem and kept it hidden all this time. They chose power over morals. The political nature of their rouse is evident in the fact they did not share the information with the Dem member of the page oversight committee. So trying to say their release now is dirty politics is beyond the pot calling the kettle black...it's disgusting.
Foley is gone!
Instead of hanging on a-la-Barney Franks or Gary Studds, Foley was shown the door.
Case closed.
George Ryan tried to plead ignorance that he was merely negligent about not following-up on indicators of corruption. When the truth came out, what did we learn about Ryan?
Blagojevich is trying the same defense. He was merely not aggressive enough at pursuing the bad apples. Who believes Blagojevich isn't in on the corruption?
And Hastert and Shimkus are trying to claim that they were merely negligent by not digging deeper after learning about the emails.
Here's why I was pretty sure Ryan was guilty. The underlying crimes benefitted Ryan. The money went to his campaign coffers.
The corruption in the Blagojevich administration: who benefits? Rod Blagojevich.
And Hastert's negligence: who benefits? The House Republicans. Either Hastert knew about the IMs or he knew that if he kept digging the story would get worse. So, to protect the House Republicans, Hastert stopped digging.
So, you don't have to prove Hastert saw the IMs to know that he failed to protect the pages from predator Mark Foley. Hastert made a willful decision to stop investigating. He should be held accountable for his decision.
I agree with Sen. Dick Durbin that the page program should be governed by public servants, not politicians, as it is in the Senate.
I think Hastert was in jeopardy anyway, and this only makes matters worse for him. DeLay no longer has his back. He's probably going to lose 10-15 seats in the House. Including two top tier races in his own state. He's strategy of backing Bush to the hilt has been a political disaster, and the GOP has no message now. Finally, if the GOP maintains control over the House, it will be only by a razor-thin margin, and they are going to need a very different kind of leadership and image.
Worst-case scenerio for the Congressional GOP would be holding onto very slim margins in both chambers, staying the course, and losing 20+ seats in the House in '08.
That said, Shimkus should resign that post or be removed. He IS the person who should have taken care of this a LONG time ago. This is something that he IS directly responsible for, and he dropped the ball big time.
After that, we should move on. Our soap opera culture loves this stuff, but we have much bigger issues and problems facing our country than a repulsive former Congressman from Florida.
Either he has integrity or he doesn't. Like being pregnant--it's all or nothing.
But "negligent and ignorant" of what? Neither Shimkus nor Hastert are human resources professionals or personnel managers. And this is a human resources/ personnel problem. Just because one sliver of their roles includes some "human resources" aspect, their failure to do anything more than instruct Foley to back off the solicitations is not so significant in view of the big picture. Shimkus and Hastert are elected to make laws, shape policy, and, as members of the leadership, lead the Congress and their party in doing the business of the Congress. Their failings, if genuinely any, as "personnel managers" are too insignificant a matter to result in an immediate leadership shake up.
To Democrats, I say bring it on... If you want to scream about Congressional child endangerment, you will lose the attention of the voting public.
The URL for the Sun-Times power rate hike AD is corrupt. You've got an apostrophe in the URL and that's not allowed.
Invalid character in /2006/10/04/rate-hike-may-be-jolt-but-don’t-pull-plug-on-process/
The URL can only contain alphanumerics plus the following characters: /.,=:_-
10. Sen. Daniel Inouye. The 82-year-old Hawaii Democrat was accused in the 1990s by numerous women of sexual harassment. Democrats cast doubt on the allegations and the Senate Ethics Committee dropped its investigation.
9. Former Rep. Gus Savage. The Illinois Democrat was accused of fondling a Peace Corps volunteer in 1989 while on a trip to Africa. The House Ethics Committee decided against disciplinary action in 1990.
8. Rep. Barney Frank. The outspoken Massachusetts Democrat hired a male prostitute who ran a prostitution service from Frank’s residence in the 1980s. Only two Democrats in the House of Representatives voted to censure him in 1990.
7. Former Sen. Brock Adams. The late Washington Democrat was forced to stop campaigning after numerous accusations of drugging, assault and rape, the first surfacing in 1988.
6. Former Rep. Fred Richmond. This New York Democrat was arrested in 1978 for soliciting sex from a 16-year-old. He remained in Congress and won re-electionâ€â€before eventually resigning in 1982 after pleading guilty to tax evasion and drug possession.
5. Former Rep. John Young. The late Texas Democrat increased the salary of a staffer after she gave in to his sexual advances. The congressman won re-election in 1976 but lost two years later.
4. Former Rep. Wayne Hays. The late Ohio Democrat hired an unqualified secretary reportedly for sexual acts. Although he resigned from Congress, the Democratic House leadership stalled in removing him from the Administration Committee in 1976.
3. Former Rep. Gerry Studds. He was censured for sexual relationship with underage male page in 1983. Massachusetts voters returned him to office for six more terms.
2. Former Rep. Mel Reynolds. The Illinois Democrat was convicted of 12 counts of sexual assault with a 16-year-old. President Bill Clinton pardoned him before leaving office.
1. Sen. Teddy Kennedy. The liberal Massachusetts senator testified in defense of nephew accused of rape, invoking his family history to win over the jury in 1991.
Why do you want to punish the pages for something the Republicans did?
That's like saying we should abolish the Army because Rummy and Cheney planned the Iraq War so poorly. Please.
Republicans are the ones who should be removed for their transgressions -- not the kids who are just there to learn and to serve their country (or in the case of the Army to fight for their country).
What is the job of a Page? I was one in the Statehouse....hated it. Fetched Lunches, laundry etc. Oh, once session was rolling we distributed the bills but now that can all be done now electronically.
I could not believe how the legislators acted during session it was worse that my college frat.
I say if there is no valid purpose for the program GET RID OF IT? If they perform a valid job, then fine, but most of their work can be done electrionically.
If I had my way it I would institute a 2 term limit on all elected officials, it would keep them from thinking they were so privileged, and maybe make them work harder at getting things done rather than playing political games.
The election will decide if the Republicans find the Maltese Falcon (a majority).
Their front page story today - "Under Fire" - featured a picture of Denny Hastert's head that was - well - as big as his head.
The biggest beneficiaries of this scandal may be Todd Stroger and Rod Blagojevich, as the Tribune is forced to divide it's coverage over the next 30 days to fullfill it's self-proclaimed role as the conscience of the Republican Party.
Should Shimkis step down? NO
The Democrats are doing a great job of tieing two seperate issues into one story. Hastert had full knowledge of the emails that were sent. Did any of you actually read the emails in question? The emails might seem creepy (questions asking the paige what he wanted for his birthday, about his family, etc) but nothing sexual in nature. The emails were simply inappropriate for a business releationship. Hastert and his staff acted, and Shimkis took care of it.
The Instant Messages, however, is where the problems lie. One example is: [i]"Can I have a good kiss goodnight?" Foley was said to have asked in one message. A boy responded with cyber symbols and "kiss."[/i] Foley obviously has issues.
Hastert and Shimkis were not aware of these IMs. The Real person that should be questioned is the staff member who leaked this to the press instead of reporting it to the Speaker's Office or the FBI. You can see that the timing is purely political and meant to damage the GOP's chances in the fall.
It's a shame no one is giving you props for your "Maltese Falcon" dead-on interpretation of the situation. Congratulations!! I think you should start a second question of the day: A pool on the date on which either bin Laden is captured (dead or alive) or Iran is invaded. You know it's "Wag the Dog" time when Ray LaHood is the one making sense ...
It would be interesting if any of these "indiscretions" come to light before the November General Election.
Ashur Odishoo
Candidate
State Representative 11th District
Are you sure the emails were all they knew about?
If the pages were openly discussing Foley hitting on them for years, shouldn't Shimkus have been attuned enough to figure it out?
And how do you justify keeping the emails from the other two members of the committee overseeing the page program, Reps. Dale Kildee and Shelly Moore Capito? Doesn't withholding the information suggest Shimkus knew what Foley was doing and had made a conscious decision to protect him?
In my opinion, if you asked either Hastert or Shimkis what an IM was, they wouldn't have a clue. Outside the people who post on this blog, its pretty safe to say that no one over 30 would know what an IM is.
Shimkis was given the information regarding the email correspondence, and he dealt with it. Why should the information be passed on to more people? According to the AP, the parents of the page asked that the emails be ended, and that nothing more was to be made of it in order to protect her son. Shimkis followed their wishes.
If you want to spin conspiracy theories, lets play this one out... Had the IMs been brought to their attention back in 2003, don't you think that they would have dealt with the situation right after the 2004 elections? If they were aware, I would guess that Hastert and Shimkis would have pushed Foley to retire in early 2005, so that they would have plenty of time to choose a replacement and position him/her to hold that seat.
The story broke before an election. Having been around the block a couple times I know that people are more likely to leak damaging information before an election. So what? Just because Blago's $1,5000 check and property tax assessment came out during an election doesn't mean that Blago's conduct shouldn't be criticized. Right?
The IMs aren't the issue. The issue is that Mark Foley was trying to have sex with pages and Shimkus and Hastert had indicators this was the case but chose to remain ignorant. Or in Shimkus' case, he probably knew and was facilitating Foley meeting more pages.
--
Wheres the leadership?? --
You wrote, If I had my way it I would institute a 2 term limit on all elected officials
Every state that has instituted something like that (where all legislators and statewide officers are term limited) has found that the lobbyists end up taking over because they are the only ones with any institutional memory.
Like it or not, I'd rather have elected officials at least nominally in charge and nominally answerable to voters as opposed to allowing lobbyists even more power than they already have.
--
Citizen Kane -- Shimkus is both a father and formerly a teacher, as is Hastert. It wasn't just "overly friendly" emails (one red flag right there). It was also dinners and drinks with 16-year-olds (another red flag). It was also warnings from GOP staffers to pages as early as 2001 (see any more red flags? I do).
Want another HUGE. RED. FLAG. Citizen Kane? How about the remarks Congressman Foley made after Congressman Shimkus introduced him at the 2001-2002 outgoing page ceremony:
Mr. SHIMKUS. I thank my colleague. Now someone who spends a lot of time with you also, the gentleman from Florida (Mr. Foley), would like to say a thank you.
Mr. FOLEY. I warn all of you not to cry in front of me, please, so I can get through this very important day with you without shedding tears as well. […]
…and finally John Eunice. John was the highest bidder on lunch with Mark Foley. Maybe you all do not know this story, but John had paid considerable sums to dine with me. I had offered to take the winning bidder to lunch in the Members’ dining room. Then I heard how much John Eunice paid. And I said, “John, there is no way in the world after you committed so much money to have lunch with me that I would dare take you downstairs to eat in the Members’ dining room.'’ I said, “Where do you want to go?'’ He says, without reservation, “Morton’s.'’ I said, “Morton’s? Like in Morton’s Steakhouse?'’ He said, “Oh, would that be too much?'’ I said, “Oh, no, we’ll go.'’ I said, “Call your mother, get permission, make sure she notifies the Clerk and we will go to Morton’s.'’ And so we proceeded to cruise down in my BMW to Morton’s. And all of this story is meant to make you all feel jealous that you were not the high bidders. So we went to Morton’s, and I do not know where you all went.
What's it going to take for you to drop the partisan blinders and stop defending the indefensible? Foley was preying on 16-year-olds and our Republican leadership did nothing (except, as Bob Novak informs, apparently cajole Foley into running for reelection just to retain a GOP seat).
Pathetic. Pathetic. Pathetic.
2003 Instant Messages. (in possession of someone)
2006 E-Mails come to attention of Hastert, Shimkus, various media and FBI.
Shimkus tells Foley to knock it off.
Media and FBI take no action because innocuous.
Nothing further from Foley to Pages.
5 weeks before election the mysterious holder of the 2003 instant messages distributes them to the media.
And Republicans claim the problem is the motives of the people who released the IMs?
What would have been so hard for Hastert and Shimkus to do the right thing? Either could have asked for a more complete investigation into Foley's conduct. They didn't. Why not? They put the good of the House Republicans ahead of the pages, right?
Spade - Rich Miller
Joel Cairo - Foley
O'Shaughnessey- Reynolds
Spade to Cairo
'When you get slapped, take it - and like it.'
Later,
Gutman to Spade
'By Gad, Sir, You are a Character. 'Pon my Word.'
I think the smartest play would be a bipartisan emergency committee to take over the program and reformat the leadership so both parties have control and cover at the same time. One Dem and one Rep in charge. Bringing in a third overseer from the pool of ex-pages would be a good move as long as their public record is clean. The Third Man (what's with the old movie references today?) would break any ties when the leaders have to make a decision.
Shimkus will be re-elected, serve 1 more term and then retire in 08, way past his "term limit".
But the other issue is that Shimkus, Hastert and other Republican leaders covered-up Foley's activity, the same way George Ryan stalled and covered-up in the license for bribes scandal and the way Blagojevich is stalling and covering-up now.
Is it wrong when Republicans cover-up a Republican Congressman sexually pursuing pages?
Gentlemen, this is an "October Surprise."
Mr. Foley's actions are reprehendible. That goes almost without saying. But they were not secret. There are multiple indications that hundreds of beltway insiders, including pages and their parents and staffers and members of congress -- of both parties -- knew that Foley was light in his loafers and much too much interested in other people's kids.
Look at the time-line in this a.m.'s NYT. The media "discovery" of this seems to have been with some "watch dog" group and then ABC. Where did they get the info? Who decided that a few weeks before a very close congressional election, an infered child molestation scandle was just what was needed?
Answer: the persons who would benefit. But they are only the oportunistic messengers, not the persons responsible for this scandle.
Who's responsible? Like the Bishops who swept clerical abuse under the carpet, the bishops of the house are responsible for this national black-eye. They should resign.
I know we Democrats have a long history, covering the last 4 decades, of ignoring our own members who have done this very same thing. Heck we even went so far as to throw our full support behind our child molesting members even after they were convicted.
But we're not talking about us we're talking about a Republican now so there should be a different standard. We feel the Republicans should be held to a higher standard in regards to political conduct than we ourselves are held to. As Democrats we're not responsible for our actions it's always someone else's fault.
Stay tuned lots more to come.
I was watching Fox news earlier and gentleman from the Reagan administration says that anyone who had anything to do with this scandal should resign. That would be you Shimkus.
Blame the media.
Blame the kids.
Blame the Democrats.
But the GOP ?
Hey, lets not play the blame game, okay ?
Your thoughts on the afternoon radio post?
There might have been an "October Surprise" - but it would have been October 2005, an off-year.
If Shimkus, the Chair of the Page Board, had done his job, then he should have had this scandal out in the open a year ago, and it would have been addressed and behind the GOP.
Shimkus, this "surprise" could've been sprung in any month you preferred. It was in your hands.
And the Speaker's hands.
And Reynolds' hands.
Any of you could have picked the timing. But you sat on it because you were afraid to deal with it.
This is your own doing.
Hastert and Shimkus should resign. Now.
Nice spin. As I mentioned when this story first broke, Republicans will try very hard to "bipartisanize" this issue, just as they did with the Abramoff scandal. It won't work. Not to mention how desparate Republicans look going back 30 YEARS to find parallels to Foley in the Democratic Party, or that not one of these cases parallels the Hastert-Shimkus cover-up.
Hastert and Shimkus' handling of all of this reminds me a Sgt. Schultz of Hogan's Heroes: "I see nothing. NOTHING!" If they had exercised due diligence, we would've found out about these instant messages ten months ago. Now, they want to blame the media for not doing their job for them. Ironic, and that won't work either.
I recall the initial Washington media frenzy over the Valerie Plame story, but now even the Washington Post has turned strongly against Joe Wilson. Let's see what is real, and what is frenzy. It's Washington, after all.
I'm certainly not convinced someone shouldn't resign from something, but it should only occur if real misconduct, not hype and innuendo, is shown. This is obviously an election season play, but there is substance to it, given Foley's conduct, and all the facts have to be stated.
For example, I note that the accusation against Hastert and Shimkus is of not taking appropriate action, which is a far cry from the criminal investigations we have to deal with in Illinois. Even Foley is not accused of actual physical molestation (yet?), although the racy e-mails to a 16 year old are truly bad enough.
I note that the family of the Page who received the 2005 e-mail affiratively asked that the response be limited to telling Foley not to contact the Page, and Shimkus did just that. Whether Shimkus should have respected the family's wishes, as he did, or told them that this was too serious and had to go to investigation, is a very fair question, and will turn on what he actually knew of Foley's actual conduct.
As far as Hastert, I have yet to see how he actually knew anything, but this is only developing, and we shall see.
Schnorf nails it right on the head. I am in agreement with the assessment.
Mick Jones may be the best pundit on the topic of Hastert's future: "If I stay there will be trouble. And if I go it may be double."
Shimkus RESIGN!
These men do not deserve to serve the people of the United States of America and especially the great state of Illinois. What I find interesting is that Hastert asks for the advice of the Catholic Archdiocese. Where else would one go to get the BEST cover up advice available?
Does this mean he was drunk when voting on legislation? Does this change a rollcall on any votes?
Notice how the GOP response to issue of the Republican leadership covering-up Foley's predatory behavior is to try to change the subject to anything else.
Did Shimkus have enough information to fill-in-the-blanks on Foley? Kinda hard to tell since he's ducking media outlets that will ask him this kind of question.
When someone acts guilty and there is circumstantial evidence that they have misbehaved, is it an unreasonable inference that something bad happened?
That’s a flat lie.
There have now been at least two high-level GOP figures, Boehner and Reynolds, who gave direct quotes to the press saying Hastert personally knew about the Foley “problemâ€Â. Hastert has pointedly refused to dispute Reynold’s assertion.
The undisputed facts here are these: the GOP pages (but not the Democratic pages) were “warned†about Foley as of 2001. GOP Members Alexander, Shimkus, Reynolds, Boehner, and Hastert, at minimum, knew about the problem. It came up very directly again in late 2005, and there are stories in the press describing Hastert and the others as discussing the problem multiple times between then and the spring of 2006.
And nothing happened.
Hastert himself knew, his office knew, and a sizable chunk of the leadership knew  and they just didn’t do nothing, they PREVENTED the usual channels from even investigating the claims.
Are you sure you want to stick out your neck for Hastert?
CNN - http://www.cnn.com/2006/POLITICS/10/04/foley.ap...
I didn't believe Clinton should resign over Monica, and I thought we were silly to impeach him. To me, it didn't rise to the level of something a President should lose his job over and we were acting as partisans out of our dislike for Clinton and Hillary. I wonder if that's what's happening here.
So, even if more damning evidence comes out, I'm not sure that anyone should resign, but I'm pretty sure no one should yet.
"Should a president resign if he is caught boinking a page, male or female? Hummm."
If you're trying to be clever and refer to Bill Clinton and Monica Lewinsky, then let me remind you Lewinsky was 22-years old when she had sex with Clinton.
GOP Rep. Foley has admitted to preying on 16-year olds.
Or as you might call it - "boinking."
What's most disturbing, though, is your suggestion that GOP Rep. Foley shouldn't have resigned.
Nauseating.
Why did Shimkus keep the emails from Reps. Kildee and Capito?
Accordingly, Members and their staffs owe a special duty to these children and to their parents, as shown from the below excerpt from an online article from ABC News.
“The bright high school juniors who come to Washington to be pages are wards of Congress, much like orphans were when the House first hired them to run errands in centuries past.
In their gray and navy uniforms, they get a taste of power while doing humdrum jobs, serving at the whim of an institution that shelters, educates and pays them while they are far from home.
The potential for abuse is apparent, as it always is when power and powerlessness are in the same room….
Members of Congress are expected to take special responsibility for the welfare of pages and act in place of their parents. Protections introduced since the early 1980s include an increase in the starting age of pages to 16 from 14, dorms for them to live in, heightened supervision and a board to protect their well-being.†(http://www.abcnews.go.com/Politics/print?id=252...)
****
House Pages have done nothing wrong, and yet Hastert and the GOP leadership who failed the Pages now want to destroy the House Page program. The House Pages were the innocent victims here, and now Hastert and the GOP want to punish them - again.
****
I have a proposal for Speaker Hastert, Shimkus, Boehner, Reynolds and the rest of the GOP leadership who failed - intentionally or unintentionally - to protect children: demand that Foley donate his $2.7M campaign warchest to the House Page program to create real safeguards for these young people.
Haster is toast as far as House Speaker goes. He probably won't resign but after the election when new leadership is chosen, he will be sitting on the sidelines.
Shimkus, you are a total embarassment to yourself, your family, your constituents, and please stop waving the West Point banner. I am VERY familiar with West Point and you sir are no Norman Schwartzkopf. The very least Shimkus should do is resign his position as head of the pages. The very most he should do is be forced to send his children to D.C. to be pages.
This has possibly been a criminal cover-up. It's bad enough that our politicians are slimy, sleazy, cheaters, liars, and crooks. Do we as voters not have a limit as to the corruption we will tolerate?
As for Hastert, he's toast. After the election, he will not remain as Speaker of the House. Shimkus should resign at least his post as head of the pages.
After wasting $70M+ and years of Congress’ legislative time and resources on Monicagate, Whitewater, Travelgate, and every other failed GOP “investigation†and “hearing†in the 1990s, the GOP now sides with alleged sexual predator Mark Foley and the GOP leadership who protected him and says after 6 days we should really ease off and let cooler heads prevail.
Wow.
It would be a laughable suggestion, coming from this GOP Congress and their media lapdogs, if this wasn't the most important topic conceiveable: protecting children from sexual predators.
The victims here are 16-year old House pages, not Denny Hastert and John Shimkus.
Perhaps this incident is one of the reasons Shimkus is avoiding the media.
The people sticking by Shimkus and Hastert are being as partisan as Shimkus and Hastert were when they stood by Foley.
Shimkus has explaining to do.
1. What did he know? And when?
2. What did he do or neglect to do to protect Foley?
3. To what extent did he facilitate Foley meeting pages he wouldn't have met otherwise? And did Shimkus provide this "service" to any other members of Congress or Washington, DC powerbrokers?
(I'm sure the answer will be no, but I'll return to this post when the answer to the above question is known)
A stinking drunk Foley was turned away from the page dorm.
Perhaps this incident is one of the reasons Shimkus is avoiding the media.
The people sticking by Shimkus and Hastert are being as partisan as Shimkus and Hastert were when they stood by Foley.
Bet this happened when Terry "Tommy Gun: Gainer headed the Capitol Police. Let's get him on the horn and ask for the reports.
Or did he and Shimkus run over to the campaign committee for another meeting?
I do think there is real trouble here for somebody other than Foley, but I'm not sure who it is. I'm not even sure this rises to criminal conduct by anyone, even Foley, though I strongly suspect the e-mails must have violated something more than common decency. It will play out fast, that's for sure! So let's get to the facts - it should only take a few days.
I never suggested that Foley shouldn’t have resigned. That sicko should be prosecuted to the full extent of the law and sent to do some time with people who can take care of perv's like him.
Whether 16 or 22 it's an abuse of power. If the young Pages were afraid to come forward to their superiors, where were their parents? If my kid told me this, I sure wouldn't stand idly by. I would be talking to my attorney and the press.
First, its immoral and repugnant that Foley thought of the House page dorm as a one-stop shop for sexual predators.
Second, its disturbing that the GOP leadership STILL DOES NOT GET IT !
According to the article, Rep. Deborah Pryce, R-Ohio, "'contacted the clerk and asked her to look into this rumor,' said Geoff Embler, a spokesman for Pryce. Rep. Roger Wicker, a Mississippi Republican, asked Pryce and other House leaders, including House Speaker Dennis Hastert, about the alleged incident during a conference call Monday evening, Embler said."
GOP Rep. Pryce reported the alleged preying on minors to the House Clerk, a direct employee of the GOP Speaker - why didn't Pryce contact the House Ethics Committee or the House Page Board ?
GOP Rep. Wicker raised the incident during a conference call with House GOP Members - why didn't Wicker refer the incident to the House Ethics Committee, the House Page Board and/or the Capitol Police ?
The House Republican leadership continues to treat Foley's crimes against children and the leadership's cover-up of these crimes as a political matter to be strategized.
This is not an earmark for a road, an amendment to a trade agreement, or some other bill that the Speaker and the Republican leadership can bypass establsihed committees, procedures and the minority party to deal with.
Parents know this is different, and the House GOP had better damn well know this.
Former Governor gets six years for this and that.
Current Goveror is under investigation by the feds.
Hastert and Shimkus both involved in "Foley Scandal."
Cong. Davis visiting "terrorists" in Sri Lanka.
Jack Ryan had to drop out of Senate race for possible nefarious behavior - to be replaced by.....Alan Keyes (?)
Cook County broke and under federal investigation.
And then there's always Mayor Daley and the Chicago machine.
I love it! People around the country must be getting a kick out of this State!
This story has doomed the Republican effort to hang on to control of the House of Representatives - regardless of how the Republican leadership questiion is resolved.
The longer this story gos on the worse it becomes for Republicans.
Hastert won't be speaker anymore come January.
If this guy Fordham is correctly quoted by the AP, then it's exactly what I was talking about.
Let's see what is real, after the Beltway hysteria has run its course.
And our Governor is probably still floating his name around Washington for a possible shot at the big time. I'm sure he is convinced he still has a chance at running for Prez.
"If Hastert and/or his staff knew - and Shimkus did not know - anything but the excerpts of that first e-mail, will any of the people commenting here apologize to Shimkus?"
You and the rest of the GOP lemmings STILL don't get it.
The "first email" was enough to put Shimkus on notice. As Hastert stated, the "first email" was a red flag of a situation needing swift and comprehensive action.
So the "first email" was enough for Shimkus to require to do what he was supposed to do, i.e. live up to his duty to protect the children of the country.
Shimkus likes to puff out his chest and say he's a West Point alum, but he failed to live up to the West Point creed: Duty, Honor, Country.
To Scott Fawell's Cellmate: Only you and your Democrat lemmings continue to press the issue that Shimkus knew more than he actually did (according to the evidence in published reports). Is there any evidence to suggest that Shimkus had knowledge beyond the first e-mail? Listen to the Brennan interview at KMOX.com. Shimkus handled the issue by following some of the wishes of the page's parents. Are you faulting that? Shimkus has apologized for taking the word of an elected colleague (Foley) and, yes, it has burnt him. But is there evidence that Shimkus is involved in covering anything up? Not yet and there probably won't be. The only evidence is just the partisan hype and speculation from the hacks that read on this blog.
Shimkus should not only step down as head of that Page program, he should announce he's going to keep his term limit promise afterall.
These two guys exemplify better than most how the Republicans have betrayed the hopes and aspirations of the 1994 Revolution. They've gotten fat and arrogant faster than the Dems did in power.
Speaker Pelosi is scary to say, but these clowns we've left out there too long have squandered our trust and brought this on the country and the Party. After 2 yrs of the Dems in control, we'll take another shot at getting some better Republicans in there.
More shoes are going to drop on this scandal. Hastert and Shimkus need to do the right thing NOW.
Enough of the postering- let the FBI do their job.
Let's not get TOO serious about this wanting to get all the facts first thing.
It's also obvious that you are unable to separate the facts of this ongoing scandal to make separate determinations between what Hastert, Hastert's staff, Shimkus, and what any other people might have known.
Whether we agree or disagree has no bearing on pointing out the errors in your analysis.
The attacks on Shimkus' "duty, honor, country" is same smack that the Downstate Democrats For Change (and other former Tim Bagwell volunteers) have been pushing for over a year now. It's insulting and shows the partisanship that most voters in the 19th District flat out don't tolerate.
If Shimkus' future is to be determined by his "duty and honor", I like his chances.
Per the State Journal this morning: "With all this on Shimkus’ plate, he still showed up Tuesday to meet with our editorial board. We appreciate that, but we weren’t surprised. Few who have met Shimkus would question his decency. Even those who disagree with his conservative Republican politics still tend to like him and describe him as a “good guy.†Yet even good guys make mistakes."
Shimkus is accountable and doesn't back down from a fight. He made a mistake, but this talk by his opponents of this being more than a mistake is hurting any chance Stover might have had.
The evidence clearly shows that Shimkus knew of one e-mail, nothing more. Your suggestions that any smoking gun sits in the 19th District are false, unfounded, wrong, lacking evidence, and full of partisanship.
But, please, keep up the partisanship. Southern Illinois voters will love the changes Nancy Pelosi and Danny Stover will be bringing to the country.